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Last updated on March 6th, 2018 at 12:31 am
Sheikh Feiz Muhammad last year told a Sydney audience that victims of sexual assault deserved to be raped:
She has no one to blame but herself, for she has displayed her beauty to the whole world. Strapless, backless, sleeveless – they are nothing but satanical.
Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali—Australia’s most super-dooper Sheik—has lately picked up on that same theme, according to the Australian:
In the religious address on adultery to about 500 worshippers in Sydney last month, Sheik Hilali said: “If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside on the street, or in the garden or in the park, or in the backyard without a cover, and the cats come and eat it … whose fault is it, the cats or the uncovered meat?
“The uncovered meat is the problem.”
The sheik then said: “If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred.”
A lot of things don’t occur if you never leave your room. Ask any prisoner. I’m actually hoping that the Australian has gotten this wrong somehow, because the quotes attributed to Sheik Hilali (resident in Australia for nearly 20 years) are so incredibly, astonishingly abhorrent as to invite disbelief (you’d expect less vile public opinions from someone with any political sense). Yet the paper publishes further post-speech comments which support those alleged lines from Hilali:
He told The Australian the message he intended to convey was: “If a woman who shows herself off, she is to blame … but a man should be able to control himself”. He said if a woman is “covered and respectful” she “demands respect from a man”. “But when she is cheap, she throws herself at the man and cheapens herself.”
If he said that, and the preceding remarks, Hilali should be confined.
UPDATE. Pru Goward wants him deported:
Australia’s top Muslim cleric Sheik Taj Aldin Alhilali should be sacked and deported for comments which essentially excused young Muslim men who committed rape, federal Sex Discrimination Commissioner Pru Goward said today.
UPDATE II. In accordance with Islamic tradition, Keysar Trad claims the comments were taken out of context:
“He wasn’t talking about rape in any way,” Mr Trad said.
“He wasn’t talking about standard norms of dress in Australia or any country, he wasn’t talking about the hijab, he was talking about people who engage in extramarital sex.”
UPDATE III. Withering condemnation from the Muslim community:
At least one Muslim leader has branded the Australia’s Mufti “out of line” for his comments blaming immodestly dressed women for sexual assault.
The former secretary of the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils, Shujat Mantoo, said the Sheik Taj Aldin Alhilali was probably out of line, but he defended the Muslim cleric’s right to stay in Australia.
UPDATE IV. Stronger condemnation from the Islamic Council of Victoria’s Waleed Aly; also Labor leader Kim Beazley and Treasurer Peter Costello.
UPDATE V. Victorian Liberal MP Sophie Mirabella:
“I have a message for Sheik Alhilali: This is Australia, not Iran, and violence and degradation of women is not acceptable,” she said.
“If he wants to sprout this type of offensive discourse, perhaps he should be making these comments in an Islamic state – something that Australia never has (been) and never will be.
UPDATE VI. Our pals at muslimvillage have apparently published the phone number and two email addresses of the journalist who wrote the Hillali article.
- There need be no shame where outrage has become obsolete.Posted by Harry Bergeron on 2006 10 25 at 03:13 PM • permalink
- Hmmm.
So if I’m turned on by veils and burkhas I can rape muslim girls with no objections by the Handrag Headdress Set?
Posted by memomachine on 2006 10 25 at 03:21 PM • permalink
- But if this were some old-time white male reactionary back in the 1950’s talking about the culpability of rape victims . . .
Well, I thought we were way beyond taking such thinking seriously because we routinely mock it as a parody of propriety and virtue.
But since this guy comes from one of those ‘authentic’ (read: non-Western) cultures and wears funny robes, we all have to take him seriously. I guess we’ve come full circle.
Steyn wrote something similar about polygamy, how it will be considered an oppressive abomination right up to the moment some imam suggests laws against it are an affront to Islam.
- Hmmm.
Hey I come from an “authentic” (read: non-Western) culture. Does that mean any old bit of nonsense that might float out of my butt is the Ultimate Pearl of Wisdom?
Well, well, well. And my old school chums said there wasn’t any advantage in being Korean. How little they knew back then eh?
Posted by memomachine on 2006 10 25 at 03:30 PM • permalink
- Hey I come from an “authentic” (read: non-Western) culture. Does that mean any old bit of nonsense that might float out of my butt is the Ultimate Pearl of Wisdom?
Back in the 60s, 70s, and early 80s it meant you could start your own religion on the US west coast and have no shortage of young credulous nubile followers willing to do your bidding. Sometimes just being wierd was enough.
Posted by Bruce Rheinstein on 2006 10 25 at 03:42 PM • permalink
- For all the lefties out there – conduct this little thought experiment. Close your eyes and imagine that instead of the Sheik you have the Catholic Cardinal Pell and put those same words in his mouth. Imagine just how absolutely outraged you would feel, the rage, disgust and abhorrence. No doubt you would be motivated in writing to the editor, staging a demonstration or demanding that he step down as a spokesperson for his faith and the church. Now uncover your eyes and take a look at one of Australia’s leading muslim clerics after he has just spewed forth such vile filth. Why is it that you are now feeling your righteous anger shrivelling away and turning rancid like so much uncovered cat meat in the sun?
- Hmmmm.
Back in the 60s, 70s, and early 80s it meant you could start your own religion on the US west coast and have no shortage of young credulous nubile followers willing to do your bidding. Sometimes just being wierd was enough.
I wasn’t old enough back then to start my own religion. Lord knows I tried but my mother put a stop to it when I began recruiting for my cult.
Dammit! Yet another reason why it sucked to grow up in the 1970’s!!
Posted by memomachine on 2006 10 25 at 03:50 PM • permalink
- The only uncovered meat here is Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali. About 6 feet should suffice for him.Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 10 25 at 04:15 PM • permalink
- Funny how our system of laws etc let a person like this to spew pure shit to the people within our community. I know that this may sound a little not PC, but fuck it!!!, Send him back to where he came from, his family included. If he can say what he is purported to have said in public then he obviously doesn’t want to stay in a wonderful country like Australia and can go back to the shit box he come from and have his wonderful life there.
Pricks like him walk around being so friggin pious it makes me just want to beat him, but then again I would rather a lot of “Satans Devices” to beat the living shit out of him whilst wearing their bikinis. On second thoughts that would give him too muchpleasure, just beat him with a leg of ham.
What a wanker!!!!
Posted by artful-dodger on 2006 10 25 at 04:23 PM • permalink
- Why is it that the bloghead is only interested in women’s rights when they are besmirched by the Islamofashionistas? Is this the only besmirching around worth a quick cut and paste? Or is it that this is the only one that will get the troops fired up and drive some measily blog ad traffic?
Must be why this cheap agitator is happy “scroll past” an actual rape by good Werribee boys of non-Middle Eastern appearance?
Must be why he doesn’t bother to note that “Australia’s most prominent female Muslim leader, Aziza Abdel-Halim” said Hilali had “disgusted and offended” her.
Has she ever got a run on the blogmire?Posted by Miranda Divide on 2006 10 25 at 04:29 PM • permalink
- #10 #9–paco: Is WHAT the fault of a, b, or c?
Oh, c’mon, Forbes! Obviously, I’m asking . . .er . . . well, I’m asking whether . . . hmmmm . . . (Dang! How did I get myself into this? I’d better tap one of those brainy coves for advice. Let’s see, what’s MentalFloss’s telephone number? Here it is. Hello? MentalFloss? Look, I’m sorry to interrupt your multiple, simultaneous chess games with those Russian guys, but check what I wrote; the “it” does seem to have a missing antecedent. What should I do?. Uh huh. Uh huh. Yeah. Brilliant! Thanks.)
Hey, everybody: Forbes hates cats!!
- “The only uncovered meat here is Sheik Taj Din al-Hilali. About 6 feet should suffice for him.”
I wonder what the reaction would be if an important Australian told the Sheik that his comments might radicalise ordinary Australians and cause a terrorist attack to be carried out against him. Would he take it as an implicit threat (as he should) and look like a hypocrite?
- ed:
Didn’t you see the ad in this month’s Tolerance ‘n Diversity?
Yes, you too can become part of the global grievance industry. Learn how to snooker naive mama’s boys in the West who are just waiting to kowtow and apologize to you.
Here’s how:
1. Cook up any grudge, no matter how ancient or outrageous.
2. Howl with indignation and rage to get attention and keep your mark on the defensive.
[Helpful hint: Remember, they’ve been conditioned to experience reflexive guilt. Any who don’t fold will be cowed into doing so by others like them who are eager to please you. The more outrage, the more guilt! What could be easier?]3. Demand concessions, accommodation, special privledges, compensation, whatever. Use your imagination! They’re rich and terribly ashamed of it.
4. Threaten that if all your demands are not met—or are even questioned—there will be more anger, outrage, alienation in response to their ‘provocation’.
You get the drift. Oh, and one final thing. They’ll do anything to ‘stop the fighting,’ so implied threats of violence almost always work. Besides, any who really ‘resist’ will be punished by their own authorities.
What are you waiting for? Get on board the grievance gravy train. Call now. Operators are standing by.
- He’s right. Shit happens when you leave your hijab. So do us all a favor and go back to your hijab in Iran or other shithole middle eastern country you come from.Posted by swassociates on 2006 10 25 at 04:56 PM • permalink
- Make no mistake, the idea that women who do not wear the hijab invite rape is another decietfull lie form the head taqiyist of Auatsalia.
it does not matter if an infidel woman is naked or totally covered, she has the same status as a cow to these muslims. So superior are they that they can do ANYTHING they want to her.
She is as he says “a piece of meat” for the enjoyment of muslims.
In fact they even resent the fact that such a lowly creaturs such as a kaffir woman and arouse them sexually.
I remember how Janet Albrechtson got pounded by the idots at the ABC for suggesting that a few years ago.
Now it has become common knowledge. Will the extreme feminists see the light?
- #16 Miranda Divide –
Why is it that the bloghead is only interested in women’s rights when they are besmirched by the Islamofashionistas?
Ok, for the first time, I did read one of Miranda’s comments (I didn’t look first at the name of the poster). Here’s an answer for you.
This blog is owned by Tim Blair and is visited by many interested parties, most of whom are conservative or libertarian. We all are fundamentally concerned with the human rights of all people, everywhere, regardless of circumstances. This includes the right to live, to think as one chooses, and to behave according to one’s own dictates and values as long as it doesn’t unreasonably infringe on the rights of others.
This is especially true for women. Yes, it’s true that we might not say anything when some lesbian couple’s attempt to be married in a local Pentacoastal church against the will of the minister and congregation is rejected by the courts. But we damn well will protest when a Muslim utters depraved statements that deny the dignity and rights of women.
You should too.
Posted by wronwright on 2006 10 25 at 05:00 PM • permalink
- All you guys pointing out that lefties would be up in arms if a Christian was saying these things are missing one possibility: That it’s not the sentiment that would get them up in arms, but merely who voiced it. In other words, if you criticize them for being hypocrites due to their silence, you implicitly assume they really care about the actual issue. I wouldn’t be so sure of that myself.
- FOR G”D”S SAKE MIRANDA!
The disgusting acts commited by the weribee boys are not UPHELD by western culture or Judeo Christian morality. No Christian cleric or politician will try to justify these degenerate acts.
But the Acts of raping and demeaning kaffir women are justified by some KORAN texts hadiths and Suras. That’s why the Sheiks defend them . they are simply saying that no muslim can be found guilty of rape against western women in islamic law.
- I find it interesting that he’s not just slagging off kaffir women, but immodest muslim women, too.
And, I really don’t understand why everyone is getting so upset at him saying such a thing – in his mind, it’s true. Look at the way Mohammed treated women. Look at the women in Pakistan, Bangladesh, Iran, Afghanistan (particularly under the Taliban), Nigeria, Egypt.
It’s all quranically sanctioned, and if she’s not under house arrest or on her mahram leash, she’s fair game.
Now that I’ve got that off my chest, I like Davo’s idea of the Sheik getting the crap beaten out of him by a bunch of girls in bikinis. With legs of ham. Talk about bringing on cognitive dissonance – he wouldn’t know which way to react. Does he run from the pork or to the meat?
From the article, muslim women are upset, but again, they should read their quran and hadith. Look with open eyes and critical faculties.
Rip of the rose-coloured glasses of religious fervour and self-chosen victimhood and see!
Posted by Nilknarf Arbed on 2006 10 25 at 05:20 PM • permalink
- What a pig.Posted by surfmaster on 2006 10 25 at 05:33 PM • permalink
- What an utter, utterly boorish jackass of an excuse for a human being. I hope he gets put in prison so he can try to rationalize how it wasn’t his fault when Bubba gets him up the ass.
Sorry, shiekh. If you were foolish and immodest enough to uncover your bigoted little heinie in the showers, then it’s not the other guy’s fault, is it?
Posted by Tungsten Monk on 2006 10 25 at 05:51 PM • permalink
- Have a talk with my Kuwaiti-born daughter-in-law sometime if you want to get an ear full.
Arab men are cowards. Arab men are disgusting. Arab men are dirty. Arab men have the morals of rats. Arab men treat women worse than they treat their animals.
Don’t get her started on Iraqis or Palestinians either. At 19 her father had to hide her from rape gangs in a cellar for 6 months during the Iraqi occupation.
I’ll go with family on this one. In Arabia the wind doesn’t blow – it sucks.
- ’”But the problem, but the problem all began with who?” he asked.’
The problem is the existence of people like you, sheikh, and I know an easy way to solve that problem.
Posted by Dave Surls on 2006 10 25 at 06:17 PM • permalink
- All he means is that he’s turned on by a little arm or ankle. He generalizes the effect, he theorizes why this is.
Back when I was a regular connoisseur of fire-and-brimstone nutball radio preachers, I particularly liked this guy who in every message managed to get in women wearing pants suits and their provocative asses, and the immediate death by traffic accident of somebody as a result, and eternal burning. Every message.
The guy was obviously a butt man, and universalized the fetish into a religious teaching.
These guys get the run of Islam, apparently.
What they don’t have is radio shows and an amused audience.
Another favorite was a “retired pharmacist’’ who I think used to stutter, and avoided any perceived upcoming difficulty with subordinate clauses, which were added without limit as necessary, until the hard word was avoided. He’d send you free literature but you had to promise to send it back. He was more into biblicized diet teachings, and spoke directly with God in between sermons.
It was all the free market, and if people didn’t enjoy you for whatever reason, you didn’t get enough contributations to pay the station for the airtime, and you disappeared.
Islam should take that course, which is the way of peace, rather than the protection racket they run now
- I think al-Hilali is quite right.
A hijab can protect a woman from rape…
…if she uses it as a garrotte on her attacker.
— Nora
Posted by The Thin Man Returns on 2006 10 25 at 06:30 PM • permalink
- But… but…. the burka empowers womyn!
It gives womyn total freedom not to have to brush their hair, or apply makeup, or any number of the personal encumbrances required by this capitalist and consumerist society.
It gives womyn freedom from the unrealistic societal expectations of beauty and slenderness.
It promotes womyn’s mental well-being in those who may not quite attain the levels of “perfection” required in the heathen eyes.
It significantly reduces the incidence of rape of womyn in general society, as the hair rays cannot be seen and thus drive the men crazy.
Womyn everywhere need to reclaim their rights to their bodies through the burka!
- #11 Alpha
Keysar Trad is out there telling everyone that it’s about “fidelity, adultery, marriage…” and that Hilbutthead has been taken out of context… (Now, we must remember that ‘adultery’ in this context is always sex of any kind out of marriage – even holding hands or kissing is adultery if you aren’t married – and if you are married, well, it’s not allowed either.)
The difference between this religion and others is that when these ‘leaders’ spruik their filth the idiots who follow take this as the rule to live by – and there have already been rapes and assaults of women, both western and others, who don’t ‘cover up’ by these people. I take it very seriously. They are not talking figuratively, or in parables, the fools that follow them blindly cannot think for themselves.
You’re an idiot cosmo.Miranda, you haven’t been paying attention. You’re an idiot, too.
- #29 Rod C.
Unfortunately, the Sheik (piss be unto him) is an Australian citizen. You can thank Paul Keating personally for that.
- I’m with Nilknarf; this bloke is being entirely consistent and his words should not be a surprise. Remember the speech was in Arabic and he usually doesn’t expect to be heard by “outsiders” (Australians).
But in this case it was recorded and translated. He is certainly dishonest in hiding from us outsiders what his real teachings are, so he’s now trying the usual nifty but patently obvous backtracks after being accurately quoted. (I wonder if the Oz has exclusivity, as it hasn’t been reported in the Fairfax press.)
The only people who have reason to be really upset are those who are trying to present modern Islam as predominantly moderate.
- A blast from the past! Over four years ago, I emailed a comment to Tim at the old timblair.blogspot site, on a veil-related thread. (It didn’t have open comments then.):
UPDATE. Wicked reader Edward G. writes:
Veils, or at least scarves, may become popular in Germany, Norway, Denmark, and the Netherlands once word gets around that it’s a good way to keep from being raped.
posted by Tim Blair at 9/2/2002 09:40:00 AM
Now it’s no longer a “wicked” joke, and an imam is saying it out loud, not in Norway, but in Australia. God help us.
- ASK THE IMAM
Islamic Advice from Imam Waleed al-KahleeverSheik Taj Din al-Hilali of Wangaroomabongabinga, NSW asks:
If you take out uncovered meat and place it outside on the street, or in the garden or in the park, or in the backyard without a cover, and the cats come and eat it … whose fault is it, the cats or the uncovered meat?
This is a very interesting question. With respect to cats, the Q’ran in Surah 12:45.1(c) states that, “the cat always lands on its paws.” However, Surah 3.14e-9 says that “pita bread always lands hummus-side down.”
Of course, this creates a perplexing question: what if the believer were to glue a hummus-laden pita to the back of a cat, and hurl it from the local prayer tower? Only then will we know which Sura is more powerful in the eyes of Allah and His Prophet. Perhaps the key is to first put the uncovered meat between the cat and the pita, in a sort of cat-meat-pita sandwich. As it falls from the tower, the cat will eat through the glue to get at the delicious uncovered meat, thereby freeing the pita to land hummus side down, and the meat-refreshed cat to land happily on its paws. In this way you may demonstrate to the kuffar the perpetual perfection of the Word of Allah, as written by the Prophet (peace be unto him).
Confidential to AM of Kangalangaroombawoomba, Queensland:
If this girl persists in her wanton tantalization, apply corrective raping.
- And hats off to Pru Goward for coming out swinging on this creep and his pointless medieval religion.
Let’s keep the pressure up on him in the media and in the political sphere. Maybe he won’t or can’t be deported but at least Australians will develop a better understanding of the ugliness he stands for.
- Isn’t he condoning Men of Middle Eastern Appearences who rape non-Muslim women? Where is the outrage from the left, from the feminist groups, from the Labor Party? Their hypocrisy saddens me.Posted by Wylie Wilde on 2006 10 25 at 07:38 PM • permalink
- Oh good. iowahawk’s essay is in. crittenden got his in last week. paco, you’re up next with the next installment of Detective paco.
May Tim should consider naming his blog The Strand.
Posted by wronwright on 2006 10 25 at 07:44 PM • permalink
- The revered Mufti has been preaching in these terms ever since he arrived in this country,the harangue quoted in The Australian today is relatively restrained compared with those delivered on other occasions,particularly in the early 1980’s.Even before he acquired permanent residency,courtesy of Keating & McLeay, translations of some of his work at Sydney University and Lakemba were in the hands of Labor Members of Federal Parliament but were ignored because it was believed that el Hilaly could deliver Branch-stacking fodder to the NSW Right to help them defend their State and Federal preselections against incursions from the Left,and it worked.Of course the downside has been that a substantial number of Labor Parliamentarians owe their prosperity to Hilaly’s followers and can be regularly be called upon to ensure that a blind-eye is turned by Police towards anti-social or even criminal activity by his desciples.It’s only in the last 3 or 4 years when young muslims,perhaps taking Hilaly too literally,went on a pack-raping rampage and drive-by shootings became standard Saturday night entertainment for these vermin,that the State Labor Government reluctantly started to take some action which up until now has failed to discourage these activities.
it drives the left to distraction, which, though not difficult, is a good thing also.
You mean they notice? That’s odd; it’s more typical for them to ignore the inconvenient statements of favored minorities. Look at Miranda, above, or at the reactions to black racism here in the states.
Posted by Rob Crawford on 2006 10 25 at 08:05 PM • permalink
- Iowahawk @ 52
Absolutely fucking brilliant! All this talk about rape makes me have a hankering for another Mother Earth Virtual Cruise Night. Whens one coming?
As you said very well, the Earth is the ultimate MILF.
Posted by swassociates on 2006 10 25 at 08:06 PM • permalink
- But… but… he is bravely condemning the sexual objectification of women! Wearing a bag over your head can be SUCH a liberating experience! Why, he ought to come campaign for Hillary…Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 10 25 at 08:11 PM • permalink
- #52 iowahawk
Priceless! Thanks
Now I’m wondering if Farouk, Ali and Achmed will be discussing this in the near future?
Posted by aussiemagpie on 2006 10 25 at 08:23 PM • permalink
- #6 Well said, veru well said.
Secondly, will we western men rise up to defend this slander of our womenfolk? Imagine if it had been a Christian leader making these statements abot muslims?
Where is noted feminist blowhard Eva Cox in all this. I can imagine the headline ‘Imam savaged by Cox’.
For him at least it wouldn’t have been the first time thats happened.
- “Why is it that the bloghead is only interested in women’s rights when they are besmirched by the Islamofashionistas?”
More to the point “Miranda” – why are you only NOT interested when it is the Islamofascistas?
You owe an answer to this but as you are an intelledtual coward wnd will not reply.
It’s OK. We all know what you are.
Posted by John Fembup on 2006 10 25 at 08:41 PM • permalink
- Must be a lot of “The uncovered meat is the problem.” in France. As they are deploying or having on stand-by as, (and that is exactly what they will do, stand- by)….France Prepares 50,000 Riot Police for Muslim Attacks
Since appeasement alone is not a strategy. French authorities are keeping a force of some 50,000 riot police in permanent stand-by. A ministry spokesman said it is important to find “the good balance: not overreact to the situation, but at the same time, not underestimate it either.”
via
Sure gonna look pretty, when those 50,000 white flags, march through the Arc de Triomphe.
- #42
(I wonder if the Oz has exclusivity, as it hasn’t been reported in the Fairfax press.)
I doubt it. Unless the NSW Police website has exclusivity on the words “of Middle Eastern appearance” which Fairfax doesn’t report either.
I suspect they are being “sensitive”. If a Priest or a Rabbi had said it on the other hand…
- I’m astounded that anyone is surprised that this view is not only held by the likes of el Hillbilly, but by the vast majority of “moderate” Moslems. An utterly alien culture, which has no place in a modern, secular society which places great value of individual rights and responsibilities.
Anyone who thinks that women should dress like beekeepers or mobile letterboxes is welcome to think so- I suggest they do so in a state which reflects their atavistic views like Saudi Arabia or Iran. Regular flights are available.
- The full veil dont work either. I spoke to a well educated chap from Afghanistan, a tacher by profession. We were having a conversation about his local area when for no apparent reason he dropped in something allong the lines of “I came across a woman byherself working in a field so i raped her.”
I was quite shocked but didnt let on, and he continued, his whole reasoning behind the rape was she shouldnt have been out alone like that and had been asking for it.
So sorry but unless your covered up AND inside your rooted!
Ps: I advised him to never do it again, and never speak of it again. He had a missus and a couple of kids and didnt seem likely to do it again. He got his visa.Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 10 25 at 09:12 PM • permalink
- Hate to tell you this folks, what filth Hilali speaks is part and parcel of many Muslims’ mindset and can be attributed directly to the way the Koran, Hadith and other Muslim writings portray women.
It’s not just cultural. It’s religious. It’s inherent in Islam. Even Muslims will tell you this –
in a round about way.Only one option in my view.
- And for those who can’t be bothered, the money quote from the Koran
033.059
YUSUFALI: O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.
PICKTHAL: O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them (when they go abroad). That will be better, so that they may be recognised and not annoyed . Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful.
SHAKIR: O Prophet! say to your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers that they let down upon them their over-garments; this will be more proper, that they may be known, and thus they will not be given trouble; and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.Cover yourselves so you won’t get molested.
Dawood, whose translation I use as it is much clear, does clarify:”draw their veils close around them…That is more proper, so that they may be recognized, and not be molested.”
So how does covering up make you recognizable? Guess.
I jokingly summarize it this way: men can’t keep their dicks in their pants, a woman is to blame and any uncovered woman (inference being she is non-Muslim) is fair game for anything from harassment to rape.
- I agree with saint, misogyny comes out of an accurate reading of the Koran.
What I find curious is the attempt to paint those who are “good muslims” as somehow extreme and unrepresentative of their faith.
Talk about transference – The ABC are particularly good at portraying the Sheik, and others who get caught out, as unacceptably extreme and therefore not truly representaive of the Islamic sensible moral center -people just like us.
Folks there aint a sensible moral center in Islam.
- #29 Rod C – It goes further than you suggest. A condition of Naturalisation is to be of good character. Therefore, if a naturalised person proves NOT to be of good character, Naturalisation can be REVOKED and that person deported.
I think it is very important we get that mesdsage around.
Posted by Susan Norton on 2006 10 25 at 09:38 PM • permalink
- Especially if an uncovered Bedoiun bint is enough to send you into a priapetic fit, you shouldn’t be allowed near any Australian dairy farms, let alone any
- Tim
The sheik’s comments are nothing new. Many sheiks and Islamic leaders the world over say the same thing. The problem is not isolated to those sheiks who articulate this Islamic view of women—the problem is that it is an accepted aspect of Islamic teaching.Egyptian scholar Sheik Yusaf al-Qaradawi claimed in 2003 that female rape victims should be punished if they were dressed immodestly when they were raped. He added, “For her to be absolved from guilt, a raped woman must have shown good conduct.”
I can give you more examples of outspoken Islamic leaders and what they have said—it’s all the same. It is perfectly fine to rape women who do not wear a headdresses. And this is what is happening in many countries including France, Sweden, Norway and here in Australia in the nortorious gang rapes in Sydney.
- Gee, I wonder what the root cause of the Cronulla Beach squabble was? We all know what cats do when they’re confronted by meat and a sand box.Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 10 25 at 09:57 PM • permalink
All you guys pointing out that lefties would be up in arms if a Christian was saying these things are missing one possibility: That it’s not the sentiment that would get them up in arms, but merely who voiced it. In other words, if you criticize them for being hypocrites due to their silence, you implicitly assume they really care about the actual issue. I wouldn’t be so sure of that myself.
Spot on, PW. Miranda is a classic example of this. Had s/he followed rbesca’s thought experiment in #6, I expected that his/her head would have exploded.
That, of course, assumes that s/he is capable of thought in the first place.
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 10 25 at 10:25 PM • permalink
- Here we go again.
Choice quote:Come on can’t you read between the lines. There is a conspiracy against us Muslims you would be crazy not to see that. Why is it that these journalist don’t go to other places of worship and record what they have to say? Why only the mosques? This person has probably recorded hundreds of his sermons and listened to them hours and hours looking for any mistakes he can take out of context. I am sure the Sheik had meant something else altogether. How could you trust such a rat bag as this Richard Kerbaj. His surname sounds like an Arab surname; he is probably an Egyptian Coptic or Lebanese Maronite. Some of these people hate Islam and Muslims to the core.
While I don’t believe that it is a Women’s fault for being raped and that the man who did it should be executed I do however ask the question would she have been raped if she had wore the hijab? It seems that the more that women decrease their clothing the more the sexual assaults increase, right or wrong? This is fact you can see it for yourself on the statistics. Since this so called sex explosion started in the 60s and when women wore less and less clothing the sexual assault crimes have indeed increased. See for yourself.
And about this women Ms. Hage-Ali whether she can provide proof or not she has no right to comment on our behalf, unless she has been elected by the Muslim community.
So there you have it. Young muslim women are not allowed to disagree with the sheikh unless they have been given permission by the muslim community, the sheikh has been taken out of context and women who don’t wear any muslim identifier are asking for it.
And he reckons there’s a conspiracy against muslims??
Perhaps this commenter would feel more at ease in Saudi, where there would be no fuss over an uncovered woman being raped.
I’m sure if it were his sister who was assaulted because she managed to get out of the house for a bit of fresh air he would have no problems raising all the hue and cry necessary to get the law to respond rather than expecting her to go top herself for bringing shame onto the (male) family honour.
There’s that word “hypoctrite” again.
Posted by Nilknarf Arbed on 2006 10 25 at 10:36 PM • permalink
- Kae, I thought Cosmo was taking the piss.Posted by Nilknarf Arbed on 2006 10 25 at 10:37 PM • permalink
- Sheikh Feiz Muhammad is not playing smart. Talk the multicultural talk but walk the neo-primitive walk.
“Australia’s most prominent female Muslim leader, Aziza Abdel-Halim, said the hijab did not “detract or add to a person’s moral standards”, while Islamic Council of Victoria spokesman Waleed Ali said it was “ignorant and naive” for anyone to believe that a hijab could stop sexual assault.”
Aziza Abdel-Halim and Waleed Ali know there is more afoot than this. As Islam becomes more exclusive and puritanical, Muslim women all over the world are coming under increasing pressure to cover up. It is disingenuous to state that veils are merely’ Muslim identifiers’. If so, why aren’t men asked to wear them?
Pamela Bone is right: “When women’s faces are concealed but men’s faces are not, the implication is that only men are capable of sexual desire. Either that or – if you accept that having a sexual thought is sinful – it implies it doesn’t matter if women have such thoughts because their religious piety is not as important as men’s. These are hardly ideas that fit with women’s liberation.”
Or basic humanity where the feelings of attraction between men and women are considered bestial and women’s identity cancelled, their sexuality neutered and their right to freedom of movement denied. To claim that gender apartheid is ‘liberating’ is a joke.
This is not just someone else’s ‘reality’ but a mindset which is becoming increasingly pathological. It must be combatted at every turn.
- Oops. There’s that lack of previewing again. Hypoctrtie shoudl be hypocrite.
Also, I recommend reading my linky above to the muslimvillage forums, because while there is the usual whining and seething, there are also some comments of remarkable clarity:
So, the number of elderly women wearing tracksuits or heavier, more voluminous and modest styles are also ‘asking to be raped’?
Like it or not, rape has always been the weapon of choice to keep women under the male thumb. At the risk of repeating myself, rape is NEVER about sex, it is about power. Some men, who are themselves victims or who are lacking in self confidence, self assertiveness and the like, rape women as a symbol of their power, the weaker the women ie. old and frail, the easier it is for these sick individuals to perceive themselves to be powerful. This is what they crave, not sex.
And think about it seriously. Whilst I don’t know the statistics for rises in rape incidents. You can’t look at the 60’s and say ‘ahh less clothing – more rapes’, however you can look at the 60’s and say ‘ahhh women’s liberation – more powerful women, decreased power to men – more rapes’. You also need to take the ‘increased rape statistics’ with a grain of salt. Back in the 60’s, rape was hardly ever reported, these days women are more likely to report the attack, although a much higher perentage do not get reported due to the stigma.
Posted by Nilknarf Arbed on 2006 10 25 at 10:51 PM • permalink
- #92 – “I’m sure if it were his sister who was assaulted because she managed to get out of the house for a bit of fresh air he would have no problems raising all the hue and cry necessary to get the law to respond rather than expecting her to go top herself for bringing shame onto the (male) family honour”
I would hope he’d opt for the former but sadly the evidence suggests that he’d take the “we must kill her to restore family honour” approach.
Posted by Whale Spinor on 2006 10 25 at 11:00 PM • permalink
- The sheik then said: “If she was in her room, in her home, in her hijab, no problem would have occurred.”
True.And if the guy had been let into the country it also wouldn’t have occurred. It also wouldn’t have occurred if “religious leaders” didn’t offer excuses.
By the same token, Muslims who flaunt their religion, rather than keeping it hidden and at home, are asking to be beaten up. Same logic.
Gosh their culture is Sick.
Sorry, I work with some Muslims, they’re sane, reasonable, rational. The Lakemba Mosque strain of Islam is probably truer to the original than the one my friends and colleagues practice, but it’s positively Evil. It’s gotta go.
- Heh. Well, the charming folks at muslimvillage have also posted the author of the Australian article’s contact details – work and private email and a mobile number.
I’ve already sent him an email of support, so if anyone else wants to join in, his work is:
kerbajr@theaustralian.com.auPersonally, I don’t agree with posting all sorts on contact information in public like this, but since it’s out there, we might as well support him.
Posted by Nilknarf Arbed on 2006 10 25 at 11:07 PM • permalink
- Habib, you bastard!Posted by SwinishCapitalist on 2006 10 25 at 11:07 PM • permalink
- This muslim leader should be made to face the consequences of saying these types of things in public like any normal Australian. But hang on, thats right, he thinks like a jihadist so he hates us and does not respect the place or people where he lives. He spends a lot of time in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan where these kinds of comments are common and approved by the religious authorities. Perhaps soon now the public will realise that muslims say one thing to the press and another thing when they are in the mosque. They are encouraged to lie and cheat the infidels who they believe are evil unclean people who should die for their sin of not being a muslim. They are also taught that they have no responsibility to anyone but a muslim.
They have to try to convert them yes but after a refusal the head chopping can begin.
Bottom line from the Islamic text book is that woman are Satan’s tools to tempt men and should be covered and not trusted. And that a rape is a woman’s fault period.This is now becoming obvious to even the casual news watcher.
Hopefully, Australians demand the standards we apply to ourselves be applied to these backward 14th century dictatorsThis mufti should go to jail for hate crimes. He has done this several times now in public.
If I said stuff like this in public and it made the news then the demands for my scalp would be ringing.I say hang him high and make him do service at the local rape counciling centre and animal shelter.
- When I see the Muslim community come out against a flat statement such as this, I no long feel any sense of thankfulness, but rather I know that they are dissembling for my benefit. I don’t know how long it will take for people to understand that the nature of the way the religion relates to unbelievers makes it impossible to take them at their word when they are speaking for our benefit. All it takes is a week of reading MEMRI, or just the translations of a Friday night’s sermons from the Mosques, to show what these people really think and say among themselves, and to understand that they do not speak honestly to unbelievers. They don’t leave us any way to know how, or when, to trust their words.
Miranda, you are silly.
- Deportation isn’t an option. As repugnant as his views are the precedent will be set about other unpopular opinion. Better of exposing him to ridicule and isolation like owe home grown Neo-Nazi’s.Posted by armageddon on 2006 10 25 at 11:55 PM • permalink
- yeah salty, quite right and i suggest adding the Film ‘Obsession ‘ to that list downloadable from googlevideo.
Obsession radical Islam against the west
- Never forget peoples that its was Paul Keating who facilitated this prick to be able to stay in Australia.
The immigaration minister of the time (I think Chris Hurford), wanted to deport him back to Egypt.
Since f-ing Alhilali was in hiselectorate, Keating demanded he be allowed to stay (he could send a lot of Muslim votes Keating’s way).
So next time shithead Keating opens his trap and pontificates about something, remember it was he, Keating, who is responsible for this dirt bag in a sack being here. Keating again….. aaaaaaahhhhhh….
- Can’t say I agree with those who want to deport or lock up Sheikh Hillbilly for his remarks. He’s got a right to speak his mind just like the rest of us. On the other hand when he says things like this he should be mercilessly mocked in public. That’s our freedom of speech, inlcuding saying that Islam is a pernicious death cult if we wish. If Muslims try to shut off such comments by threat of violence the mocking should be even louder. Sadly, those who would spity on Christianity will surrender to the threats by Muslims, as we have seen in the Danish Cartoon Controversy.
In one of Shaw’s plays Julius Caesar describes Britannicus as “…a barbarian, who thinks that the customs of his tribe are the laws of the universe.” I’m beginning to think that sums up a lot of Muslims too.
Posted by Michael Lonie on 2006 10 26 at 12:24 AM • permalink
- Is it too late for the Sheik to institute a strip-search policy at his Mosque?.This would ensure that these evil Egyptian Copts or Lebanese Moronites couldn’t smuggle in tape recorders to catch his words of wisdom and to subsequently frustrate his usual denials or claims on his behalf by the slimy Trad that he had been misquoted.
“I have a message for Sheik Alhilali: This is Australia, not Iran, and violence and degradation of women is not acceptable,” she said.
“If he wants to sprout this type of offensive discourse, perhaps he should be making these comments in an Islamic state – something that Australia never has (been) and never will be.
Boo yah!
- Why not stone the old crow?Posted by stackja1945 on 2006 10 26 at 12:30 AM • permalink
- #9
or (d) the stone’s fault. Unless you were carrying it around just to throw at a cat.or come to think of it (e) it’s just nature’s way/fault
Posted by coot+heron on 2006 10 26 at 12:57 AM • permalink
- #16
So we’re now here in the Dr Seuss-like story:
– Person leaves meat uncovered
– Cat eats it
– Sheikh blames person
– Tim criticises Sheikh
– Miranda criticises TimMiranda, there is no word restriction on supplying a comment. You chose not to talk about the uncovered meat, the cat or the Sheikh. Just Tim.
So exactly who is the fixated, obsessed one?
Posted by manbag’s bagman on 2006 10 26 at 01:00 AM • permalink
- What a blessing it is to have the Deranged Desert Death-Cult interwoven with our multi-cultural tapestry. They have given us the kebab (inferior to the souvlaki), 3 hour queues to get on planes, drive by shootings, highly skilled car re-birthing outfits, primitive man, tribes of women who dress as if going to a fencing tournament and the cultural defence for rape. In return we have given them all this country has to offer. A fair trade I think you’ll agree.Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 10 26 at 01:29 AM • permalink
- Islamic women, don’t bother at all responding about western rape not being acceptable, we don’t want your response in our country, just remember,(like in Saudi Arabia) play with your Covered scarf islamic doll and then point to the doll and tell the Islamic doctor where you got hurt and gang raped and then he might be able to advise you of injuries.
Moderate Islamics? Never!
- London-to-a-brick-on that Miranda at #16 has visited Andrew Bolt under the name A Aristomenis
Go get ‘em Mirandy.
Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 10 26 at 02:29 AM • permalink
- BTW re #120 Can’t say why exactly, but the use of the G’day greeting is strangely familiar…Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 10 26 at 02:32 AM • permalink
- Here’s the post in the thread where a malevolent Moslem munchkin has posted the journos details- anyone with the time and skills like to out the poster? I’d give the ratbastard a call*.
*At about 3.30AM when I’m nice and refreshed, and in the mood to discuss the perfidry of religion, the sanctity of privacy and the price of piss in vaious pubs.
- further to being beaten with a leg of ham by “Satans Devices in bikins” they should also whip him with a stock whip that has been continuosly dipped in pigs blood.
Ok so the above maybe be a little O/T but what the hell. See how Sheiky thinks about that one.
Oh just a quick question, do we know dickheads personal home/mobile numbers and his email address and that of the mosque where he preaches? can we make them public and then see if some of the citizenary can call personally for a response to his comments.
Posted by artful-dodger on 2006 10 26 at 02:54 AM • permalink
- Muslim Village – Talk about overkill. Most villages only employ one idiot.Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 10 26 at 02:56 AM • permalink
- #124 SAIMA
(Stupid Acronym Indicating My Amusement)
Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 10 26 at 02:59 AM • permalink
- 1800 hrs EDST, Shake Al-Hilbilly statement read out on the radio claiming he has been “misquoted”.
Cue Keysar Trad, “. . . .His Muftiness really meant that we all should go to the footy and eat meat pies, aka ‘uncovered meat’ blah, blah, blah. . . . “
Same shit, different day. Ho hum.
Posted by Pedro the Ignorant on 2006 10 26 at 03:07 AM • permalink
- #122 The parody has come to life. What’s the line about muslims being outraged at tomorrow’s headlines? From the same douchbag who published the ph no. and email addresses:
Apparently another major story regarding “Muslims” will be breaking on Friday.
This is going to shock alot of people. I can’t say more than that (because I haven’t been told the details yet). We will all find out shortly….
Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 10 26 at 03:13 AM • permalink
- AUSTRALIAN Federal Police Commissioner Mick Keelty today warned the media against turning society so against Islam that it created a terrorist backlash.
“But I would also point out that there are many other people in the community who say offensive things from time to time as well, and many of them are … caucasian Australians.
“if we are not careful, I think we risk raising a generation of Australians who will have a bias against Islam”.JEEZ! Does’nt that make you proud of our great Aussie police!
Hey but its okay to raise a generation of muslims who have a bias against Australians right?
- Look what you’ve all done to the Sheikh!!!
A spokesman for the sheik said the backlash and criticism had badly affected him and he had been depressed and confined to bed all day, breathing with the assistance of an oxygen tank.
Poor baby – pull out the the sympathy card now then
Posted by aussiemagpie on 2006 10 26 at 03:39 AM • permalink
- Sorry the quote is from the Daily TelegraphPosted by aussiemagpie on 2006 10 26 at 03:47 AM • permalink
- ^
and this quote is from page 250 of Platform by Michel Houellebecq
“It is certainly possible to remain alive animated simply by a desire for vengeance; many people have lived that way. Islam had wrecked my life, and Islam was certainly something that I could hate. In the days that followed, I devoted myself to trying to feel hatred for Muslims. I was quite good at it, and I started to follow the international news again. Every time I heard that a Palestinian terrorist, or a Palestinian child or a pregnant Palestinian woman had been gunned down in the Gaza Strip, I felt a quiver of enthusiasm at the thought of one less Muslim in the world. Yes, it was possible to live like this.”I don’t agree with that statement but it’s certainly funny and I was looking for an excuse to post it.
- Keysar Trad is great, I find him as entertaining as the Iraqi Information Minister.
But he spends too much of his talent defending Sheikh Hilaly.. why not put some of his spin on historical events, or perhaps towards current global conflicts.
He could have made a great Nazi apologist:
“No, thats taken out of context. Chancellor Hitler was referring to a final solution for the Jewish problem of low unemployment and poor health care”Or perhaps as a spin doctor for Iran’s crazy president:
“No, those comments were taken out of context. President Ahmadinejad was specifically referring to the upcoming soccer match between Iran and Israel when he referred to “annihilating the Jewish state””
- #16, MD
an actual rape by good [sic] Werribee boys of non-Middle Eastern appearance?
Of course the Werribee boys are not Spiritual Leaders whereas the other bloke is very likely to be considered as such by many people, including important members of the Uniting Church. Therefore the other bloke is held to a higher standard and that is entirely reasonable. But he has failed, abysmally. His ethical thought is as aspiritual as his religion.
#38. Kaboom,
It significantly reduces the incidence of rape of womyn in general society, as the hair rays cannot be seen and thus drive the men crazy.
No doubt you’re joking but see #75 (frollickingmole) anyway. No amount of covering up will prevent women from being raped by Muslim men, especially in Muslim countries where men can get away with that sort of thing since whatever women say about what happened doesn’t count. That’s why there is such a very high incidence of rape in those countries. (Sorry. No link. I found one ages ago and am too tired to search it out again.)
Consider that Pakistani jails are full of women who are in there for such “crimes”. And what happens to them while they’re in jail? Why, they continue to get raped.
- I’m confused. Am I supposed to be attending some sort of anti-cat riot at Cronulla?Posted by AlphaMikeFoxtrot on 2006 10 26 at 07:02 AM • permalink
- Has anybody filed a police report to get this rabies-contaminated super horny sicko deported?Posted by Mental*Coroner on 2006 10 26 at 09:35 AM • permalink
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