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PHIL THE PHRAUD
The week the deranged president of Iran again calls for the annihilation of Israel and once again denies the Holocaust ever happpened James Carroll draws the only logical conclusion: Bush is a lunatic and this administration is run by “deeply frustrated, angry, and psychologically wounded people.”
Phillip Adams joins Carroll on a Bush-is-crazy bender:
We cannot wait any longer for the impeachment of George W. Bush. Far more efficient to have Bush certified. There is no need for further debate on his mental state. The US President is bonkers.
As it ever was, conservatives must be either evil or stupid (Bush, according to his critics, spends equal time in both camps; you’d think a wicked/dumb guy like that would be an election easybeat). Also from Phil, some military history:
Like Vietnam, the Iraq war was launched with presidential lies. Like Vietnam, the Iraq war descended into a moral and military quagmire. And if Iraq seems to be less of a stuff-up, consider this fact: it’s taken just three years in Iraq for US deaths to equal the body count after six years in Vietnam.
Very clever. US personnel were in Vietnam from the late ’50s, but their role wasn’t overt; about 400 “military advisors” were killed between 1957 and 1964. The US body count six years after actual troops entered Vietnam in March 1965 is a little higher: 53,446.
(Via InstaPundit)
it’s taken just three years in Iraq for US deaths to equal the body count after six years in Vietnam.
A memory I’ll long treasure is the look on my cow-orker’s face, shortly after he got done telling me that Iraq casualties HAD to be “up in the Viet Nam range by now.” On that day it was juuuuust over 2000. I got to watch as he googled up the answer.
sighPosted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 17 at 11:55 PM • permalinkThat’s right, buckaroos and buckarettes, SOMEBODY has to ork the cows, and it’s this guy’s job, and he’s just about smart enuf that the cows don’t get over on him too much, and I DO NOT HAVE A PROOFREADING PROBLEM!!
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 17 at 11:58 PM • permalinkWell let’s be fair. Vietnam and Iraq does have this fact in common - we’re fighting the bastards over there so we don’t have to fight them here.
—Nora
Posted by The Thin Man Returns on 2006 04 18 at 12:01 AM • permalinkPixy 7
What a loathesome lying slimebucket.
Okay OKAY, maybe I do have a little bit of a proofreading problem!
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 12:14 AM • permalinkOh don’t be so hard on yourself Stoop Davy Dave - I thought cow-orker was terrific, so illustrative, so evocative, like some kind of ancient bovine bird of legend…
—Nora
Posted by The Thin Man Returns on 2006 04 18 at 12:22 AM • permalink“Well let’s be fair. Vietnam and Iraq does have this fact in common”
Sandals. the enemy wears sandals.
Pretty much it.
Posted by Harry Buttle on 2006 04 18 at 12:34 AM • permalink#2- Phatty is among our treasures- I for one would like to see what the job lot would fetch on the open market.
(In the Phat Phuck’s case, if the buyer is interested in a by-kilo basis, we can all move to Monaco).
If you get a chance, check out one of the other op-ed items today- a really demented tirade by serial fruitcup Tony Kevin, where he tries to twist a move to protect national interest and sovereignity into an abandonment of national interest and sovereignity. What an amazing reverse-y world it must be in moonbatopia.
Is Phil Adams also considered a “national treasure”?
More like a terrain feature. As you can tell from his columns, he doesn’t get around much…
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 04 18 at 12:49 AM • permalinkI think I’ll ork some cows tomorrow at work.
Posted by Bruce Rheinstein on 2006 04 18 at 12:57 AM • permalinkIn the movie The Fog of War, Robert McNamara (US Secretary of State during part of the Vietnam War) says that he realised much later on that the Vietnamese were fighting against the US for their independence. I don’t think that the same can be said of Iraq, and that in that context, comparisons between the two should be avoided. Apples and oranges.
A point of order, if you please. This from the Carroll piece.
“The attack on Iraq three years ago was, at bottom, a blind act of rage at the way Al Qaeda and its leaders had alluded us in Afghanistan,...” What!
What happened to all that oil and the Bush donors?
And just where did all those neocons go to? The Plan for an American Century or whatever it wasMessage shape-shifting anyone.
man, if they are going to play the equivalence game between wars/presidents/death/numbers/insanity, lets see how well the “military advisers” in Columbia have been doing comparably. Oops…..nothing to see here. I’m sure it’s a disaster but just not condusive to propping up Bush Derangement Syndrome in the same manner that military advisors in Vietnam can be compared to active and “overt” presence in Iraq.
Phil Adams is a walking inferiority complex. He’s the only member of the ABC intelligencia without any form of tertiary education.
And it’s blindingly apparent from the complete absence of intellectual rigour in his work (not that the ABC is awash with it anyway!!)
Does anyone take any notice of him?
The refuge of he who cannot understand? The other bloke’s mad.
Posted by Mikie Slats on 2006 04 18 at 01:38 AM • permalinkThe orgy of Anti americanism in Europe reaches new heights in the efforts of academe to revise the history of WW2.
American and British troops were guilty of Mass Rape as they ploughed through europe with hidden agendas. Wonder how long before the corpulent one picks up on this.
In the latest excercise in leftist moral equivalence. Robert Liily’s ” LA FACE Cachee des GIs” claims the “liberators’ were no better then the conquerors.
After all if the Americans were gulty of Abu Ghraib and Gitmo is it not logical that they would have committed similar ‘attrocities’ whilst liberating Europe? Was not the demonification of Nazism merely a propaganda coup to bury their own excesses?
Phil is one of those importing Bush hatred to Australia as sanctioned by the euro intelligentsia. He is not even the creator of that hatred. merely a repetitive unimaginative troll.17.. Odd, I thought that was exactly what the Iraqi resistance was doing. The locals plainly aren’t scattering flower petals about, are they?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/10/23/wirq23.xml.The tragedy is that, total catalogue of lies apart.. the Bushniks were told explicitly that they would need, what, 300,000 men to “police the Peace” but the “supremo neocon chickenhawk moron” vetoed (as only a chair polisher can) this experienced advice from Gen. Eric K. Shinseki, subsequently dismissed and total catastrophe ensued.
Are you suggesting that the Gulf of Tonkin “incident” did happen after all??Re the allies in World War Two, they certainly set out to carpet-bomb the suburbs of German cities and kill as many civilians as they possibly could. By today’s standards, they waged ‘terror’; by the standards of that time, it was seen as a valid strategy for winning the war.
As for Abu Ghraib, Gitmo etc, imagine how lame all those WW11 ‘resistance’ stories would be: The Gestapo captures the hero, and the torturer-in-chief says, “Give us the names of all your resistance network, or we will bring in a large savage dog to growl at you, then we will attach wires to your wrist and pretend to set up you up to get an electric shock.”324- Sounds like a nice little smokescreen to deflect the obvious guilt of the Red Army in the matter of rapine and looting; a certain amount of liberation of booze etc by western allies was overlooked, any physical abuse of civilians was treated very harshly.
But it would be most unusual for the left to make things up to divert attention away from alleged crimes purpetrated by their ideological bedmates, wouldn’t it?
I suggest having a read of Berlin by Antony Bevoir as a starting point if anyone’s interested in the rotten behaviour of the Red Army throughout Eastern Europe, East Prussia and the other parts of Germany they operated in. Rape, murder and robbery were virtually institutionalised- In no way do I make excuses for the behaviour of the Sausage-Eaters in any area during the war, but the commies were probably as bad, and they were supposed to be liberators.
I now wish the Allies had left all of Europe to the Ruskies- they could have waiting for the whole rotten edifice to collapse under the weight of its inability to economically exist, and taken the lot without all the cost in men and money that the invasion incurred- I’ve come to the conclusion that a few decades of freeform socialism would have done the Euro-wussies a power of good.
To the thread.
At best Bush is an intellectually below average Sociopath who struggles to hide it.
At worst he is a Psychopath with delusions of Messianic grandeur.Ahmadinejad is also quite off his trolley.
http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0417-32.htm
That is why we should all be very scared.Oh yes, Mr. Adams, and you’re a picture, a veritable Mona Lisa, of mental health. Let’s examine the symptoms of your mental decline:
Let’s examine the symptoms of his mental decline. First, Bush convinced Americans that Saddam Hussein was behind 9/11. This is something the poor fool might have believed, given a tenuous grasp of geography, history and political reality. He then began to hallucinate about weapons of mass destruction, despite the evidence of Hans Blix and a multitude of others that there weren’t any. And he finally organised a tatty little alliance to join him in the silliest war since Vietnam, one guaranteed to recruit terrorists in unprecedented numbers.
The Bush administration said repeatedly that Saddam was not responsible for 9-11 (and that the whole point was to act before he was responsible for another 9-11). But you know that, don’t you. It might also interest you to know that the WaPo took a poll right after 9-11 (like the next day I think) and a majority of Americans, by quite a margin as I recall, said that they believed Hussein was connected to the events of 9-11. So, something or someone along the way informed that opinion, but it wasn’t George Bush because he didn’t start saying that Saddam Hussein wasn’t responsible for 9-11 until after 9-11.
Bush hallucinated about WMD just like every other head of state, every intelligence organization, every member of the previous administration, every member of Congress (okay, so my everys might be hyperbole, but you get the picture). That must have been some kind of wacky weed they all were smokin’. And of course, as you know, we have found them. WMDs I mean.
You do know that Australia is a member of that “tatty little alliance”, don’t you?
Now let’s check in with Mr. Carroll:
It was the Bush administration’s anger and despair at its inability to capture Osama bin Laden that fueled the patent irrationality of the move against Saddam Hussein. The attack on Iraq three years ago was, at bottom, a blind act of rage at the way Al Qaeda and its leaders had eluded us in Afghanistan; a blindness that showed itself at once in the inadequacy of US war planning.
Well now, how can that be? As everyone knows, Bush started planning the war in Iraq before he was even inaugurated. Because of oil. Because of daddy. Because of Halliburton. But certainly not because of Afghanistan. He didn’t have any plans to invade Afghanistan for Pete’s sake. Can’t you people keep your conspiricy theories straight?
Adams and Carroll sound like a match made in heaven. When’s the honeymoon?
Posted by Kyda Sylvester on 2006 04 18 at 02:23 AM • permalinkI smell troll.
Phatty phill would be a national tresure if hed just stop clawing his way out of the hole we put him in.
Any flogbag who has a segment in his radio proggrame called “Canberra Babylon” has to have 2 dicks. he couldnt get that stupid just playing with 1.Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 02:24 AM • permalinkAh, Dreyfuze brings up the chickenhawk meme, and garnishes it with the moron meme to boot. How quaint.
As for GEN Shensheki being experienced…..well, he was a flag officer of considerable standing, and a combat veteran, no douobt about it. He served long and honorably.
But since the United States hadn’t invaded another country on this scale since WWII, he was as equally experienced in the strategic aspects of invading and occupying nations as Rumsfeld or Bush. And the civilian leadership (who Shenseki worked for) had to keep their focus on the strategic objectives of the GWOT. Shenseki, quite rightly, focused on the upcoming invasion. The bosses made a call, and we get to live with it.
Could we have put more troops into Iraq? Certainly. Would it have done any good? That’s problematical, when you have the little matter of getting a nation to stand on its own feet, in the midst of another invasion of foreign terrorists who kill Iraqi civilians and Coalition forces alike without any qualms. You can’t be too much of a crutch, else the patient won’t learn to walk again.
And since we are seeing an overall decline in friendly deaths over the past year or so, the evidence leans away from Shenseki’s recommendations and your 20/20 hindsight (used for the typical leftie avocation of second guessing historical decisions).
So preen and posture away, Dreyfuze. The fact is, you are simply digging up an old, often rebutted argument, to support Phat Phil and his insane remarks.
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 04 18 at 02:24 AM • permalink#27 Thank god you’re here to bring a rare bit of commonsense to this thread.
Dreyf, If you were President (can we dream for a little?) - instead of the crazy one we have now- and Iran decides to develop nukes, how would you handle it?
Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 04 18 at 02:36 AM • permalinkit’s hard to pick who is more senile Phat Phil or Robert Fisk.
As Far as believing that Iraq was responsible for 911, i seem to remember that the 93 attack on the WTC was strongly believed to be the work of Iraqis.
So its hardly surprising that the second attack would have been widely believed to be from the same sources.
Although the Money Quote was from Hilary herself who is reputed to have shouted early that morning ” Oh my God, its BIN LADEN!’ or something similar on local radio.Phillip Adams should realise that it isn’t the 60s anymore. And that Iraq is nothing like Vietnam.
I would love to try whatever he eats for breakfast.
Posted by The Best Infidel on 2006 04 18 at 04:04 AM • permalink32..
“The Bush administration said repeatedly that Saddam was not responsible for 9-11..”
What?????!!!
This is COMPLETE & UTTER BOLLOX.
And you know it.
Bush said for a very long time before AND after, even after intelligence finally and firmly refuted the lies, that Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11. The only reason that a very large % of the US population believe this was because of the persistent lies that came from their (untill recently) trusted “leaders”
This blatant lie started almost before the dust settled and has only recently been respun in the hope that we are all as demented and delusional as the spinners.
“Intelligence was fixed around the facts” (MOD memo) and so on..
Don’t slander all those in the intelligence (and other) communities who did their job and tried to be heard, only to be shut up or down, all for cynical idealogical reasons that have sweet FA to do with truth, justice and defence of democracy…
Unfortunately for “Ministry of Truth” types,, the lie(s) is/are well documented, recorded and filmed. So however you try, you can’t rewrite this bit of recent history.
2/10 for effort though..Interesting how Adams makes much of his opposition to holocaust deniers and anti-semites yet when confronted with someone threatening to make the WWII holocaust look like a picnic he decides to side with them rather than heaven forbid accept Bush has a responsibility to do something to stop it.
Sad how some on the Left are devoid of reason and have to default oppose everything a conservative leader does regardless of merit.Posted by the nailgun on 2006 04 18 at 04:15 AM • permalinkDreyfuze, if you are believe that Bush said that Saddam was responsible for 9/11, it should be a simple matter to furnish us with a Bush quote that says exactly that.
And I mean an actual quote, not one furnished from your fertile imagination.
Posted by Quentin George on 2006 04 18 at 04:31 AM • permalinkOh, and reputable source too, thanks.
We’re waiting.
Posted by Quentin George on 2006 04 18 at 04:39 AM • permalink‘Dreyfuze’ says -
‘At best Bush is an intellectually below average Sociopath.’
Hmm - Is there a Harvard University ‘Average sociopath’ rating for Grads like President Smirky Cokespoon McFlightsuit?BTW -‘dreyfuze’ is a lebanese name isnt it?
Are you a Christian or mulsim lebdog?Posted by Lucky Nutsacks on 2006 04 18 at 04:56 AM • permalinkFrom Adams:
Or that many in the Republican hierarchy have joined left-wing critics denouncing the invasion as a mistake and a failure, calling for immediate withdrawal.
“Many” in the Republican hierarchy?
Anyone know of anybody in the “Republican hierarchy” who is calling for immediate withdrawal?
It seems to me (from the distance of Australia) that most mainstream Democrats - even those who (now!) say that they disagree with the original decision to invade Iraq - recognise that we can’t just “withdraw immediately”.
Is Adams just making it up as he goes again?
Cheers,
TFKWho won in Vietnam anyway?
The overarching US objective was to defeat Communism.
Communism is defeated.
Posted by Susan Norton on 2006 04 18 at 05:21 AM • permalinkTFK
Adams has only a nodding relationship with reality.
When hes not to busy sucking on the taxpayers teat at the ABC he occasionaly writes some turgid bit of mental masturbation for the Australian. I realise they need to keep a token loon in residence but Phil is just wrong on nearly every subject he touches.
he make his living telling shite to a captive country audience, and the latte set. He follows every lefty trend, and considers hes connected to the land because he has a hobby farm. He doesnt give transcripts of his show, unlike nearly every other ABC proggrame. This makes it much easier for him to ignore any past lies as it is much harder to Fisk him. Scum.Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 05:30 AM • permalink“After all if the Americans were gulty of Abu Ghraib and Gitmo is it not logical that they would have committed similar ‘attrocities’ whilst liberating Europe? Was not the demonification of Nazism merely a propaganda coup to bury their own excesses?”
One diff is that, instead of starving the prisoners, the US fattens them up.
Are we supposed to ignore Dreyfuze (French anti-semetic tragedy becoming farce!)? Someone clue me in, I haven’t quite recovered from the italics incident.
Frollickingmole, please do not insult scum by comparing them to Phat Phil. I know some genuine scum-of-the-earth. Lowlives, yes, but genuine with it. It takes effort and dedication to be a dole bludging lowlife.
Phat Phil is infinitely lower on the scale of people you’d want to hang out with than scum.
MarkL
CanberraQuote: Robert McNamara (US Secretary of State during part of the Vietnam War) says that he realised much later on that the Vietnamese were fighting against the US for their independence.
McNamara was conned by the anti-war rabbits in about 1968, when they conned the whole US population that the Tet Offensive was a US defeat. He was a technocrat with little historical sense.
Yeah, just like Castro fought for Cuba’s ‘independence’.
The FACT is that the Viets were conned and forced into fighting for Ho Chi Minh, death, and 40 years of pointless slavery… and nearly ALL of them know that now.As for the Phil Free Fire Zone: I’ve waited decades to read such satisfying stuff!
Thank the Web. You all do me so much good!MarkL
Apologies to any scum who may have been hurt or offended bt my previous comments. I realise now that my comment was thoughtless and deeply hurtfull and only hope that i can live long enough to make full penance for my misdeed.
Philly is more like the dried puss flake on the sheath of a diseased dingos donger.
Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 06:04 AM • permalinkAnyone remember Phillys collum about kerry Packers life want to contrast it with his support for a groupprotesting at his funeral?
http://www.greenleft.org.au/back/2006/661/661p4c.htm
A couple of other links involving the slimy one
About 1/2 way through this one.
http://www.aijac.org.au/review/2002/276/abc_bias.htmlhttp://www.faira.org.au/lrq/archives/199801/stories/washington.html
http://workers.labor.net.au/199/letters2_honest.html
Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 06:14 AM • permalinkOops, found it, it was Currency Lad ... but reproduced at Paul & Carls daily diatribe right here ...
Everyone, just R-E-L-L-A-A-A-X-X-X
(Yes that’s capitals, bold AND italics. Hang the expense.)Just picture Phat Phil Adams, Ducky David Marr, Bobby Fisk and all the rest of the lefty, Howard & Bush etc hating, mouth frothing, bug eyed, hand-wringing loons (yes, dryfuzz, for your ego, that includes you) as they are meant to be seen.
Just picture Howard’s Prime Ministership, and Bush’s Presidency as a roaring fire, warming and sustaining the world (stay with me here). Then picture Adams, Marr, Fisk, Mother Sheehan & all the loons as the grubs they are, curled up and comfortable in their own shit within the wood the voters have just tossed on the fire.
After a year of the fire, they get uncomfortable and spit a little.
After about 3 years they are really uncomfortable, wriggle a lot, start shifting positions and really get venomous.
After 5 years they are going crazy - can’t see any way out of their predicament (ie the incumbents losing an election) and they start screaming, twisting, scortching and their innards start cooking.
After 10 years in Oz & 6 years in US, they are completely mental. The grubs have been smoked from their cover and the flames are causing their innard juices to boil. All control has been lost and shit starts issuing out every orifice. They bounce from one place to another, making squealing and hissing noises as the fire grows ever stronger.
The following year? BANG! They rupture, causing more disgusting mess for some-one to clean up, but ultimately there’s absolutley nothing left behind except piss and wind.
(Pant, pant)
Well, the mind picture makes me smile as I go to sleep at night.
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 18 at 06:47 AM • permalink#59 On topic in thread “New #3 seeks permanent role”
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 18 at 07:05 AM • permalinkSCD (Nr.58) don’t DO that without fair warning. I nearly bloody drowned in a cup of coffee I was laughing so hard. I now have this mental image of a grossly swollen Phattie with boiling shyte venting at high pressure from every orifice like a giant brown sea urchin. Vile and strangely hilarious.
I am weirding myself out. Whisky is obviously called for.
MarkL
Canberra#15
Sound like the time that my flat mate bet me $200 that more Australians were killed at Gallipoli than Poms.
Nice little earner.
Dangerous question that!
There were more French casualties at Gallipoli than Australian.Posted by pog-ma-thon on 2006 04 18 at 07:21 AM • permalinkBy a subtle twist of fate and names, Carroll has appeared from the Tardis to warn us:
Phil is the Jabberwock.
`Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe:
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.“Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!”
That’s about as much sense as LNL usually makes, with or without somebody called Carroll.Oh, and dryfuzz?
You are that weeny, little maggot on the end of the stick. Poor thing. Doesn’t even realise that that uncomfortable warming feeling you experience everyday means, well…....
(Shuts up, steps back, smiles benignly, tips the stick into the middle of the fire to avoid any mess and gets the marshmellows out).
Definitely Glenmorangie contentment, MarkL.
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 18 at 07:39 AM • permalinkI gave up smoking so that I could hopefully outlive Phatso and could heckle at his funeral. Phat C..t.
Posted by Karl Fidel Adams-Kingston on 2006 04 18 at 07:44 AM • permalinkYikes - so many lies in one column. Lucky Adams has got Dreyfuze here to defend his tarnished honour. Anyhoo, let’s have a look at some of the bullshit:
First, Bush convinced Americans that Saddam Hussein was behind 9/11.
Nope. The administration said there could be a link between Saddam and al-Qaeda - which, as further information comes to light, appears more certain. They said there could be involvement in the planning of 9/11.
This is something the poor fool might have believed
Bush is not a fool. He may appear somewhat folksy at times, but his rather dim-witted detractors don’t seem to realise the obvious - it’s called playing to his sizeable support base. Ordinary people like to think that the President is just an ordinary guy who uses ordinary words and isn’t too uppity and affected by the heights of power (and, more often than not, wealth). John Kerry’s inability to comprehend the above probably lost him the election. The left would be well advised to stop underestimating GWB - they might actually make some headway against him if they treated him as a formidable opponent rather than a great big joke.
He then began to hallucinate about weapons of mass destruction, despite the evidence of Hans Blix
Funny, at the time Hans Blix smelt a rat re. Iraq’s WMDs. He’s been terribly clever after the fact, however. Anyway, ignore Blix for the moment. EVERY national intelligence unit, practically every political figure of credibility on both sides of the political spectrum of any importance thought Iraq had WMDs. The Brits, the French, the Germans, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, they all thought Iraq had WMDs. So did many of Iraq’s top generals. When we’re talking about those who thought (and openly stated that) Iraq had WMDs, Bush has a lot of company.
Adams’s fallacious Vietnam parallels - adequately covered above.
guru of neo-conservatism, Francis Fukuyama
Adams has never used the term “neo-conservative” authoritatively - only pejoratively. Calling Fukuyama the “guru of neo-conservatism” further underlines the fact that Adams has absolutely no idea about the history of neo-conservatism, what neo-cons believe and who the leading proponents are.
a US plan to destroy Iran’s nuclear facilities
This is a beat up, and I’m sure Adams knows this. OF COURSE there are people drawing up (more correctly, updating) invasion plans of Iran. Military strategic planners formulate these sorts of plans and ponder different scenarios, methodology and motive all the time - it’s their job. If there was no invasion plan of Iran, there’d be something seriously amiss at the Pentagon. I imagine there is - in a dusty cupboard somewhere - an invasion plan of Australia. It’s a military planner’s job to consider all possibilities.
A final, desperate throw of the dice?
Am I the only one who thinks a military strike before the mid term elections is an utterly ridiculous notion at present, all things considered that you or I or Adams currently know? Is Adams always such a hysteric?
But did Bush listen to reasoned argument last time?
Like the one you’re providing now, Adams? Don’t make me laugh. The case for war at the time was strong - and I submit that, even with hindsight, it’s still largely valid. If Iran keeps going down its current path, I reckon the case for war against it is even stronger than that against Iraq back in 2002-2003.
So it’s time to certify the President. <snip!>
I truly think he believes his delusional take on recent history. So amusing that such a confused individual should be calling for others to be certified.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 07:50 AM • permalink44.. 45..
Memory failing huh??
Google this search term (“bush 9/11 iraq link”) and you’ll get a mere 38 million references. ..
How about this??
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9020634/
And this..
http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0314/p02s01-woiq.html
The above makes the point how repeating a couple of topics again and again, like for instance, 9/11 and Saddam Hussein, associates the topics strongly in the minds of the listeners..Bush vigourously pushed the connection through the illusionary relationship between Saddam and Osama.
Like Here..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3816699.stm
9/11-OBL-SH/Iraq…
Easy Peasy for the Spinmeisters of the Bushwackers.When the myth was unsustainable…
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/140133_bushiraq18.html
Denials of the strong association implanted by repeats (as above) begin to appear. The CEO of the US of A is rotating through 180 degrees…
67.. “Said” there was a link? “Said..??”
I’ll say he “said”..
Bush (&Co;) didn’t “say” anything else from 9/11 until Ref above.. Strong Associations established there..
Its not difficult to track the origins, “philosophies” and desired outcomes for the neocom offspring of Nietzsche and Stauss. Nor where they would send the rest of us “little people” (for our own good, of course..)
And I hope that you are right and Seymour Hersch (probably one of the greatest investigative journalists alive…) is wrong. However, my money is not on you.“Those who forget (rewrite) history are doomed to repeat it.”
67..“The case for war at the time was strong..”
True, hard not to be when so many were spinning away at their keyboards, making the case.
BUT.. the facts were NOT strong, in fact they were as substantial as the smoke they were spun from. Reread the MOD memo..
As events turned out, pretty much every reason/excuse was total nonsense. Sheer invention. And now they fall back on the hoary old chestnut about democracy. Do you really believe alll that chaff and flak??
Please tell me 1 (one) lasting democracy that has been imposed on another country, under such conditions (colonial rule by the British doesn’t count for obvious reasons.)Dreyfuze. You cant be that dumb. How about 2. Ex-Nazi Germany and Ex-facist Japan. Ill even throw in Italy for shits and giggles.
Why wouldnt colonial rule by the British count??
Ooo got me there an article about how 2 topics were placed close together in speeches.
And the second point. Who was that chap al-Zarqawi whos the “terrorist mastermind” in Iraq claiming is his leader? Whats that you say? Saddams totalitaarian regime didnt have anything to do with him? Bollocks. Saddam provided funding marked “Do not use against America” to various terrorist mobs did he?
Your arguement is summed up as follows.Something GWB never said but mentioned in the context of means he meant it!
I think you should go back to finding out who was on the grassy knoll.Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 09:05 AM • permalink58.. What an amusing little tableau you present. (Chortle..)
Let us hope that the furnace that Bush, Blair and Howard have lit and continue to stoke, does not spread to all corners of our globe. Not all of us are smug, self satisified xenophobes who should be consumed in the cleansing fires and cataclysm of some deities second coming (etc etc).
Some of us just want to live and let live.Never forget Adams was one of those who wanted Latham for PM
Posted by Susan Norton on 2006 04 18 at 09:15 AM • permalink#46:
Maybe it’s a reference to the guy in this movie. Though dreyfuze’s bumbling idiocy seems to make him Clouseau, actually.
#72: “Some of us just want to live and let live.”
Yes, and hope that it’s somebody else who gets flown into a skyscraper, or blown up in a restaurant, or beheaded on television. Fortunately, the “Dreyfuze Tolerance Level for Nuisance-Level Terrorism” is not likely to become an important consideration in the formulation of U.S. foreign policy - unless, of course, someone completely “sane” and “savy” is elected: Al Gore, I presume, or maybe the other Clinton? The latter’s husband, as you probably can’t recall (and wouldn’t if you were able) responded to several major acts of terrorism by rattling his toy sword, thus emboldening those with real swords to continually raise the stakes. Had the former been elected President, we would most likely still be trying to get the U.N. to employ sanctions against the Taliban. But I am glad, old fellow, that amid the many dangers and evils in this world, you are able to find peace in that little bubble of fantasy you inhabit; may it not turn out to be the peace of the grave.
I get it. So by actually not saying Saddam was responsible for 9-11, Bush was really saying Saddam was indeed responsible for 9-11. After all, you claimed:
Bush said for a very long time before AND after, even after intelligence finally and firmly refuted the lies, that Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11.
You should have slunk away unnoticed instead of returning with this embarassing climbdown.
Posted by spongeworthy on 2006 04 18 at 09:41 AM • permalinkDreyfuze: “This is something the poor fool might have believed “
James W: “Bush is not a fool. He may appear somewhat folksy at times, but his rather dim-witted detractors don’t seem to realise the obvious - it’s called playing to his sizeable support base. Ordinary people like to think that the President is just an ordinary guy who uses ordinary words and isn’t too uppity and affected by the heights of power (and, more often than not, wealth). John Kerry’s inability to comprehend the above probably lost him the election. The left would be well advised to stop underestimating GWB - they might actually make some headway against him if they treated him as a formidable opponent rather than a great big joke.”
Eggszackly. You can imagine Bush stopping over for dinner and being happy with whatever you gave him, even if it was Spagettios. You can’t imagine Kerry and crowd looking upon you with anything but disdain, much less stopping by.
Carter, incidentally, I believe, was the “stopping by guy.”
Dreyfuze, read a book. No, not on the war, or on Middle-East history or politics. Any old book. Maybe you’ll become too preoccupied to come here and display your dumbassedry for a while.
The left still thinks this is some courtroom crime drama and that the good guys can’t make a move until they have irrefutable evidence that bad guy asshole A was involved in terrible crime B before they can bust his ass. Of course, even in real life the cops will put a bad guy away for a minor offense (Capone and tax evasion) when they know, but can’t prove, more serious crimes.
Saddam was a known asshole, who plotted against the U.S.-good enough for me.
71.. The citizens of the countries you mention had, by and large, an allegiance to their country or a figure head thereof.
Iraq (and many other colonial territories) cut across tribal boundaries. the citizens hold more allegiance to their tribe than to their country (until attacked that is).
This is an important difference.The British had a long time and a number of generations to instill their ideas and principles in the locals. Not a short sharp “shock and awe”. Even then they were not always so sucessful.
75.. Informal or not.. It exists and the import of the content was clear enough for most people.. (Fudge attempt factor 101%)
76.. US “foreign policy” takes as its primary guiding principle the total preeminence of, YES, the US of A.
Other 95% of the world?
What World??
That is the fundamental and fatal flaw in the US today. That is why it is in such a dreaful mess and can’t see its way out.78.. No, you don’t get it.. ReRead the post/thread. I’ll try words with 1 syllable if you like.
Paco - I seldom do. When I did this time, I was moved to Fisk (thanks for the kudos, btw), such was the obscene level of misinformation proffered therein. However, maybe they’re all like that.
By the way, what kind of argument is “Google this search term (“bush 9/11 iraq link”) and you’ll get a mere 38 million references”? And I guess you reckon every one of those references is solid gold, eh? How do you know that 37 999 999 million of those references aren’t people like you whinging about Bush claiming a link between 9/11 and Iraq?
Unsurprisingly, given his dismal Google gambit, the rest of Dreyfuze’s argument is blatantly irrational conjecture. No point dwelling on such a jumble of ill-conceived ramblings.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:10 AM • permalink“The British had a long time and a number of generations to instill their ideas and principles in the locals. Not a short sharp “shock and awe”.
I bet this Dreyfuze character also frets about the McDonaldisation of the third world. How do you keep all those balls in the air, Dreyfuze? Oh, that’s right - you don’t.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:13 AM • permalink79.. Talk about “dumbassedry” (Nice neologism.. may I use it??)
At least attribute the lines you are sneering at properly. I did not write what you think I did..
So, “Good ol George” is a “Good ol Down home on the Ranch Hayseed” type guy?? And he appeals to the masses does he (not so much now of course.. 32% and going South) Just about right I think.Please tell me 1 (one) lasting democracy that has been imposed on another country, under such conditions
Germany.
Japan.
South Korea.
Italy.(colonial rule by the British doesn’t count for obvious reasons.)
Those obvious reasons being that it instantly destroys your credibility, right?
That is the fundamental and fatal flaw in the US today. That is why it is in such a dreaful mess and can’t see its way out.
Reality check. The US is the richest and most powerful nation in the world, with a growing population and rising productivity and GDP. It’s the rest of the world that’s in the “dreaful mess”, as you put it.
America has strong economic growth and historically low unemployment, with no hardships at all for the civilian population, while at the same time bringing liberty to 50 million people formerly subject to two of the most brutal totalitarian regimes on the planet.
You lose.
Pixy Misa - you’re right, what you say is obvious to anyone who values reason and is able to formulate a clear analytical perspective on the world today.
However, you’re pushing shit uphill with a ranter like Dreyfuze. You can have all the logic in the world; it won’t stack up against one millilitre of his bile. I guess his mummy didn’t hug him enough when he was a child. Or something.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:25 AM • permalink82.. You asked for references (didn’t you..)
I thought you did, but perhaps I read it wrong and what you meant was that you didn’t want references. But then why did I think you wanted references when you did seem to ask for them.. YES, you did ask for references.. Do you want me to reference that??83.. Insulting Pixie..
No, They do not. Reread them with out your “Right Wing Nut Goggles” on..84.. ???
85.. No, the US makes its policy irrespective of the consequences for ANY other country whatso ever. In the end, (the earth being round and all that) what goes around, comes around.
Dreyfuze :
84.. ???
Yes, I rather thought it’d go over your head.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:29 AM • permalink90.. “..what you say is obvious to anyone who values reason and is able to formulate a clear analytical perspective on the world today…”
Just like the giant intellect below..?
88..(Dropped a dose or ten..)
“Go away and die in great pain you worthless lying gutless bigoted fat-headed fuck…”
Is this a sort of “ha(rangue)-ku”??Below what? Your posting is as incomprehensible as your thought processes.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:36 AM • permalinkOkay, we gotta stop slapping this guy around - it’s too easy.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:37 AM • permalink#91 IC
No, the US makes its policy irrespective of the consequences for ANY other country whatso ever.
This is so obviously untrue that the barefaced nature of the statement is almost impressive.
But not quite.
I mean, if you ignore all the trade agreements and defence treaties and all the US troops actually living in and defending other countries sixty years after those countries were defeated in WWII and the massive amounts of foreign aid and UN funding and, well, everything, then it still wouldn’t be true.
(Okay, apart from saving the world from fascism and communism, what has America ever done for us?)
95..Illmannered Pixie..
Under the Heading..
“Bush links Iraq war with Sept. 11 attacks”
Reuters quote…
“In a few weeks, our country will mark the four-year anniversary of the attacks of September the 11th, 2001. On that day, we learned that vast oceans and friendly neighbors no longer protect us from those who wish to harm our people,” Bush said. “And since that day, we have taken the fight to the enemy,” he said.“We’re fighting the terrorists in Afghanistan, Iraq, and around the world, striking them in foreign lands before they can attack us here at home,” Bush said.
I think the spin doctors will be very unhappy to read that you are able to seperate these two “topics”, because they have gone to a great deal of effort to fix them together in your little pixie skull..
92..Your comment is not a “clear analytical perspective” type response…
Dreyfuze - discuss “American cultural imperialism” and then I’ll get back to you.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:47 AM • permalink#103 IC
You said:
Bush said for a very long time before AND after, even after intelligence finally and firmly refuted the lies, that Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11.
This is not true. Whether you are deliberately lying, or merely incapable of differentiating between truth and falsehood, the fact remains that it is not true.
I think the spin doctors will be very unhappy to read that you are able to seperate these two “topics”, because they have gone to a great deal of effort to fix them together in your little pixie skull.
I don’t give a rat’s arse what the “spin doctors” may want. I care about what is said and what is done. And based on actual facts, you are wrong. About everything.
87.. Deluded Pixie
5% of the worlds population, using 25%+ of the resources.. Of course they have too much.
Including a Trillion dollar debt to China and facing the prospects of the world oil market (what is left of it) moving into Euros and not Dollars (the only thing that is keeping its value up..)??
US is almost as bankrupt financially as it is morally. The science and intellectual base is under increasing attack, what with “faith based science” and “creationist” standards of evidence and logic. What for the future? A nation of war?? Just like the Neocons want?? Unless they engage with the rest of the world in a constructive way, the US empire is down the gurgler.101.. Defending other countries from what exactly??
You really should get a passport, open your pixie peepers, travel a bit to learn about the world outside of the Republican propaganda “paradigm”..PS.. I understand your point..
Sorry, I was using a word like an ordinary person not a politician.
In this particular thread, for “said” or “say” substitute ” implied/imply, wilefully, repeatedly (again and again) with obvious juxtapositioning, in such a way as to make differentiation from actually “saying”, impossible for the non spin doctoring public..
My mistake.SB 25
Like Vietnam, the outcome of this conflict may well be decided by how effectively leftists stab their own troops in the back.
... cue the leftist backstabber ... ah! right on time!
Dreyfuze 26
The tragedy is that, total catalogue of lies apart..
Well, they’re relevant, in a way, but in the end, they’re moot. The only two lies that DID turn out to be lies (the aluminum tubes lie and the mobile germ labs lie) are all by themselves enough to give the whole enterprise a bad flavor. I personally blame President Bush for them, and I held them against him at election time too. Needless to say, this makes me quite the object of distrust and scorn amongst my fellow RWDBs here; but it is what it is. Lies were told.
Beyond those lies, however, lie some important truths:
1/ It has yet to be demonstrated that S.Hussein had no WMDs. Large caches of non-nuclear WMDs (toxic gas artillery shells; jet fighters; other stuff) have been found in Iraq. And there’s lots and lots of hiding places left that haven’t been checked. And there’s plenty of evidence that his main programs were just hibernating. And so on and so forth. ALL beside the point. Here’s the point:
2/ In has been demonstrated, beyond any doubt, that S.Hussein was in total NONcompliance with UN Resolution 1441, which according to the UN’s own rules, was all the warrant and sanction needed for an armed intervention into his fascistic regime.the Bushniks were told explicitly that they would need, what, 300,000 men to “police the Peace” but the “supremo neocon chickenhawk moron” vetoed (as only a chair polisher can) this experienced advice from Gen. Eric K. Shinseki, subsequently dismissed and total catastrophe ensued.
Some generals saw it Gen. Shinseki’s way, others disagreed. If we’re picking and choosing generals to back our cases, I’m picking the USMC’s Anthony Zinni. He agrees with you that the way this war started was an unholy clusterfuck, and he agrees with me that that has NO bearing on the urgent need to continue to successfully prosecute this war.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 11:18 AM • permalinkBecause the troll has been shot down on everything it says has happened in the past, now it’s predicting doom for the future. Not so easy to make a liar of a fortune teller, is it?
Textbook trollery leavened with stupidity and/or dishonesty.
Posted by spongeworthy on 2006 04 18 at 11:19 AM • permalinkGood god, where to start. People, I ask you - is it worth it. This guy is hitting all the moonbat talking points whilst holding absolutely zilch in the way of deeper understanding of the economic processes he touches upon. Why it’s fallacious to term China’s USD holdings as “debt”, that ridiculous leftist fringe hysteria about oil possibly being priced in Euros - Dreyfuze, you do realise that if oil was priced in Euros and the value of the USD fell markedly, then the “problem” of Chinese USD holdings evaporates for the USA, but becomes an enormous headache for the Chinese?
His concerns about 5% of the world’s population consuming 25% of its income - well, dude, I’m guessing that you live in a first world country - proportionally, how much do you reckon you consume? Fuck it. Stop telling others to open their eyes and open your own. Scientifically, the R&D gap between the USA and the rest of the world is widening, not shrinking. Go and use your precious Google to find out where most patents are awarded. Do you really think that “intelligent design” is making a dent in American scientific prowess? You utter fool. How old are you? 16? You really need to get out there and figure things out for yourself, rather than regurgitating all the Green Left hysteria.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 11:25 AM • permalink5% of the worlds population, using 25%+ of the resources.. Of course they have too much.
That doesn’t mean anything.
First, they bought those resources. Second, those resources are used for production. Raw materials in, finished goods out. That’s how it works.
Third, what is this “too much”? They paid for it.
Including a Trillion dollar debt to China
To put it another way: China has invested a trillion dollars in America. (A mere twelth of the US GDP, but still a reasonable sum.)
and facing the prospects of the world oil market (what is left of it) moving into Euros and not Dollars
Even if this were to happen, why do you think it would be negative, or indeed, make any difference whatsoever?
US is almost as bankrupt financially as it is morally.
“Not”, in other words?
The science and intellectual base is under increasing attack, what with “faith based science” and “creationist” standards of evidence and logic.
Nope. Compare the scientific situation in America today with any time in the past hundred years, and you’ll find that it’s better off. Creationism and it’s latest incarnation Intelligent Design have been demolished by both working scientists and the courts.
What is causing problems in academia is post-modernism (Chomsky and his ilk), but that’s only destroying the soft sciences and the arts, so no-one really cares.
What for the future?
The Moon, Mars, a Space Elevator, Nanotechnology, a Cure for Death, and Really Cool Video Games. According to this schedule, anyway.
A nation of war?
Whooee. Are you familiar with the terms Dar al-Harb and Dar al-Islam? Look ‘em up.
America is not a warlike nation. It is, rather, isolationist in its natural tendencies. George Bush’s insight is that that doesn’t work anymore. That is what he said in all the speeches you didn’t listen to.
Just like the Neocons want?
You don’t have a clue what the aims of the Neo-conservative movement are, do you? Might I point out that Neo-conservatives are, of all political movements, most similar to Classical Liberalism?
Unless they engage with the rest of the world in a constructive way, the US empire is down the gurgler.
One: The US is not an empire, never was, never will be.
Two: See economy, achievements, population growth noted previously. Cf. France, Germany, Russia & c. Conclude: Your head is on backwards.
Defending other countries from what exactly?
Blink. Blink.
Are you actually telling me you don’t know?!
You really should get a passport, open your pixie peepers, travel a bit to learn about the world outside of the Republican propaganda “paradigm”.
Teehee. Anyone want to tell Wonder Boy where I live?
Game set and match to DREYFUZE for sheer bloody guts and determination.
Dreyz, you scored the second prize to being banned by Andrea…
#111 claims victory.
LOL!
Posted by Weevil Punnet on 2006 04 18 at 11:33 AM • permalinkMajor leftie/socialist talking points have been posted. Check.
Logic has been refuted by offering faith based appeals. Check.
Assertions are offered as facts. Check.
Historical facts have been revised. Check.
HA HA HA HA HA!
Dreyfuze is just a Chomskybot, folks, not a person. An automated troll, in fact. A rather sophisticated application, combining limited artificial intelligence with real time interaction, but still mindless and unoriginal.
However, the programmer needs to revise to code to improve grammar, punctuation, and spelling. Still, an amazing replication of a typical leftie troll.
I’m impressed. But does this automation mean that the lefties are going away?
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 04 18 at 11:34 AM • permalinkLeftist back stabber 31
To the thread.
At best Bush is an intellectually below average Sociopath who struggles to hide it.
At worst he is a Psychopath with delusions of Messianic grandeur.I don’t much like him, but I have even less confidence in your psychological diagnosis of him than I had in Gen. Powell’s slide-show.
Ahmadinejad is also quite off his trolley. [link]
That is why we should all be very scared.If we need to be very scared, then Mr Ahmadinejad needs to be VERY scared. We are the Great Satan, and we’ve got WAY more nukes than he’s got population centers. Around here it’s recently been a topic of hot controversy whether or not Mr A has sense enough to rule his excitingly unstable nation in a sensible way, or in a way that gets it destroyed. Guess we’ll be finding out, some time in the next few weeks or decades.
And if your purpose here is to persuade people to be very scared, rest assured, some here are. Trick is in dealing with it, and for that, we need some ratonal foreign policy ideas. “Bail out of Iraq” does not qualify on that score.Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 11:35 AM • permalink#115 “We are the Great Satan, and we’ve got WAY more nukes than he’s got population centers.”
Hooowwee! Now we’re talking. Whose god is greatest???
Posted by Weevil Punnet on 2006 04 18 at 11:45 AM • permalinkDreyfuze 40
32..
Bush said for a very long time before AND after, even after intelligence finally and firmly refuted the lies, that Saddam Hussein was responsible for 9/11.A cursory overview of this rapidly-lengthening thread shows several commentors blowing this stupid lie of yours right out of the water, but even they are being too lenient with you. Saddam Hussein WAS responsible for, or at VERY least was an accessory after the fact to the 1993 Muslim Terrorist truck-bomb attack on the WTC. Nine dead, six stories of damage. Not a “controlled demolition” either, haw haw haw. Abdul Rahman Yasin, Iraqi citizen, built that bomb, then fled to Baghdad. This marks him as Saddam’s own bomber, leaving open only the question of whether he was in Saddam’s employ BEFORE the attack, or only “enlisted” afterward. I’d bet on “before” but it’s arguable. Either way, it’s more than enough to make Saddam Hussein the Absolute First Suspect in any subsequent attacks on the WTC, and a few years later, there was one.
Bottom line: Saddam being not directly guilty of the 2001 WTC attack is quite a different thing from Saddam being innocent.Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 11:55 AM • permalinkStoop Davy Dave -
this stupid lie of yours
You mean his entire world view, right?
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 11:57 AM • permalink“Game set and match to DREYFUZE for sheer bloody guts . . .”
Oh yes, it takes an enormous amount of courage to spew propaganda as a faceless, nameless and untrackable moonbat floating among all the other dust mites in the blogosphere, where the only consequences are an occasional smackdown from someone whose views you completely discount in the first place.
#121 “Oh yes, it takes an enormous amount of courage ... yup yup yup” Oh, faceless nameless untrackable paco, your so bloody right. (What would you do if you could track down Dreyz, anyway?)
Posted by Weevil Punnet on 2006 04 18 at 12:06 PM • permalink#125 yeah sure, fair enough! But to go all this time in this environment surely shows guts and determination, wouldn’t you agree? C’mon, give the poor old fellow a bone to chew on. And what’s the last time you took a chance?
I’m hearing you too, #122, and thanks ... ??? ... I guess !!! ... ??? ...
Posted by Weevil Punnet on 2006 04 18 at 12:26 PM • permalinkOT: Btw, I’m having a new econ prof this semester, and by all accounts he’s well to the left of the rest of the faculty. Going by his first lecture, he styles himself a critic of the mainstream; unfortunately, as far as I can tell, his critiques have holes so big that even sophomore students could drive an argumentative truck through them. (Raise your hand if that reminds you of anyone’s assertions on this thread.)
Basically, as far as I was able to piece together (he never outright stated it, perhaps because that would expose the sheer insanity of his position), he decides to take the mainstream models absolutely literally, then claims them discredited by the fact that reality doesn’t adhere 100.00% to them. Well, duh, nobody said it would. It’s going to be a fun semester listening to that guy…yeech. At least he seems to be the bleeding heart type of fool, not the ranting one.
118-Stoop, yep and it was the attempted murder of 50,000 people (the bombers wanted to collapse one tower onto the other, destroying both). Ample evidence that Saddam is an asshole as if any more was needed, but the left-continuing with the crime drama analogy-wants the jury to make no inference from the one crime to any others.
Dreyhorse sez: “79.. Talk about “dumbassedry” (Nice neologism.. may I use it??)
At least attribute the lines you are sneering at properly. I did not write what you think I did..
So, “Good ol George” is a “Good ol Down home on the Ranch Hayseed” type guy?? And he appeals to the masses does he (not so much now of course.. 32% and going South) Just about right I think.”Sigh. See, there’s this thing, it’s called intuitive thinking, or induction, or some damn thing…anyway, I was skimming away from your twitticism about the StupidBushMan and aligning with James W.‘s point—that The Great Moron just keeps outsmartenin’ all youse brain trusts AND that he doesn’t have to go around using BIG vocabulary to do it. He prolly don’t even eat truffles, neither!
And then you proved it!
Use any of my pretend words you like. I’m a Joyce fan, myself.
(Who are we supposed to ignore? Weevil Punnit? I need a scorecard.)
#128, thanx Tex I’ll take that on board, yoh, but what in particular would you do, pawdner? Seriously?...
#129, forget that course, go on the road, do anything…
#131, that’s Punnet… but you can ignore that, preferably…
Posted by Weevil Punnet on 2006 04 18 at 12:46 PM • permalink#127: No, sorry, no guts involved at all. My father once said, “Opinions are like butts: everybody has one”. No more courage in expressing an opinion than in having a butt -unless, of course, one stands to lose something. Are you and Dreyfuze in danger of being shot? Being evicted from your homes? Getting stung by killer bees? You’re not even in danger of being embarrassed: nobody knows who you are, so what price ridicule? The same obviously goes for me.
I’ll give him (and you) this much, however: you guys - and I hope you’ll pardon me, because I mean this in the kindliest possible way - you guys are the ideological and fact-free grit that stimulates the thoughtful musings of people like James Waterton and Pixy Misa, from whom we don’t hear nearly often enough.
On the one hand, Dreyfuze is being ridiculously, obnoxiously obtuse. On the other hand, it’s kind of fun to watch him/her/it get his/hers/its “points” smacked down over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. At least until Andrea gets back.
Sponge #110, there’s a real easy way to check - just borrow the Tardis from wronwright. Be careful not to sit in any puddles of mead, though, and try to ignore the goatish smell.
48
I just can’t buy that. That’s like arguing that Custer won at Little Bighorn because of the way Wounded Knee turned out.Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 01:41 PM • permalinkVietnam was lost thanks to appeasers. The war had been essentially fought to a stalemate along the north/south line. Gutless quislings in Congress decided to cut off funding to the South, and thus acceptable gridlock (after all, the war was fought because the north wanted to overrun the south) became abject defeat.
We’re talking about the 70s - Keynesian economic planning was in the process of failing catastrophically in the West, the Soviet model was (ostensibly) in the ascendance, America had lost its brash, brilliant, inspiring confidence and was in a funk; it was the era that served as a precursor to the Thatcherite/Reaganite years of deregulation that reinvigorated the West.
We need to be very careful not to repeat the mistakes of the past.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 01:54 PM • permalink72
Let us hope that the furnace that Bush, Blair and Howard have lit and continue to stoke, does not spread to all corners of our globe.
Isn’t that well versed in history is he?
Quickly, without ‘Googling’ when did terror and war with, in, for and because of, Muslims begin?
Not all of us are smug, self satisified xenophobes who should be consumed in the cleansing fires and cataclysm of some deities second coming
YOU are a “smug bastard” or “bitch”, but What in the fuck does “cleansing fires and cataclysm of some deities second coming have to do with any god damn thing”, unless of course, you speak of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinajad “Jamkaran, the shrine to the 12th imam, the Mahdi. The faithful write their prayers. He is their most revered saint, their only hope. One day, they believe, he’ll return to Earth” Oh leaving out the fucking nut part…through the well which lies under the postbox
PBS.orgSome of us just want to live and let live
By God, you are already dhimmified….FOOL.
Dreyfuze 69
Google this search term (“bush 9/11 iraq link”) and you’ll get a mere 38 million references. .. [snip]The above makes the point how repeating a couple of topics again and again, like for instance, 9/11 and Saddam Hussein, associates the topics strongly in the minds of the listeners..
Lovely. So if W says “A comma B,” you can complain about him saying “A equals B.” Then when W says “A not equal B,” you can say ...
Denials of the strong association implanted by repeats (as above) begin to appear. The CEO of the US of A is rotating through 180 degrees…
Ah! That flip-flopping W and his 180 degrees of ... wait; did he do the about face, or did you?
I’ll say this: this trick is easier to detect than it is to articulate. That’s probably how you’ve gotten accustomed to getting away with it.67.. “Said” there was a link? “Said..??”
I’ll say he “said”..
Bush (&Co;) didn’t “say” anything else from 9/11 until Ref above.. Strong Associations established there..Ah so this thing you say he “said,” but can’t quite quote him “saying,” he “said” it a lot of times and a lot of places, so there’s lots of quotes in circulation of him “saying” it, except when you look at the quotes you find ... “Strong Associations” which, for your purposes, are close enough. Your purposes are not the discovery or dissemination of truth, is how that works.
Karma: your facile attempts to paint W as a bigger liar than he is just show you up as the liar you are.And I hope that you are right and Seymour Hersch (probably one of the greatest investigative journalists alive…) is wrong.
Here’s your chance to amaze us with all the predictions, prognostications, and even current situation analyses that Hersch has gotten right.
tap tap tap tap tap
“Those who forget (rewrite) history are doomed to repeat it.”
Wow, that’s deep.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 02:13 PM • permalinkDreyfuze 72
Not all of us are smug, self satisified xenophobes who should be consumed in the cleansing fires and cataclysm of some deities second coming (etc etc).
Not all of us are smug self-satisfied bigotry-baiting phonies, but you personally are all of that, with whipped cream and chopped nuts on it.
And since you’re pretending not to notice, I’ll point out here that the presumably non-smug, non-self-satisfied, non-xenophobic Mr Ahmadinejad is the only player in this drama who is making noises, serious noises, about the fires and cataclysms and stuff. Looks to me like ” the furnace that Bush, Blair and Howard have lit” may have been well and truly ablaze before those three came along. So now, like it or not, I’m betting on them to snuff that fire. And if Mr Ahmadinejad wants to get snuffed along with it, that’s up to him.Some of us just want to live and let live.
That’s why you’re here today, right? Because of how much you just want to get along.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 02:34 PM • permalinkDreyfuze 81
71.. Iraq (and many other colonial territories) cut across tribal boundaries. the citizens hold more allegiance to their tribe than to their country (until attacked that is). This is an important difference. The British had a long time and a number of generations to instill their ideas and principles in the locals. Not a short sharp “shock and awe”. Even then they were not always so sucessful.
Here are the options:
1/ Set up a modern type of government in this occupied corner of the world, difficult and semi-unprecedented as that might be.
or
2/ Abandon this occupied corner of the world and accept whatever government happens to develop.
That’s it. There is no 3rd option. You can cry and bitch about how we ended up having only these options, which is about all you’re good for, but you cannot make a persuasive case for option #2. If you could, you certainly would have by this time.76.. US “foreign policy” takes as its primary guiding principle the total preeminence of, YES, the US of A.
Good. I’m glad somebody’s got their priorities straight.
78.. No, you don’t get it.. ReRead the post/thread. I’ll try words with 1 syllable if you like.
Sounds like ... “No, look under the shell again and see if the pea isn’t really there THIS time.” But it won’t be.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 02:54 PM • permalinkDreyfuze 103
Under the Heading..
“Bush links Iraq war with Sept. 11 attacks”
Reuters quote…
“In a few weeks, our country will mark the four-year anniversary of the attacks of September the 11th, 2001. On that day, we learned that vast oceans and friendly neighbors no longer protect us from those who wish to harm our people,” Bush said. “And since that day, we have taken the fight to the enemy,” he said.
“We’re fighting the terrorists in Afghanistan, Iraq, and around the world, striking them in foreign lands before they can attack us here at home,” Bush said.See what’s missing there is the part where he says “Saddam made those airplanes crash into those buildings.” That’s because it’s not there. You said it was there and you showed it to us and we looked, but it ain’t there. And that’s in the one quote you cherry-picked out of 38 million Google hits. So it’s fair to infer that it ain’t gonna be in the rest of them either. You stupid lying sack of fuck.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 03:09 PM • permalinkWaterton 120
this stupid lie of yours
You mean his entire world view, right?
Well, I’m tryna be all focused and on-topic and stuff here, but yeah, I pretty much do.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 18 at 03:22 PM • permalink#78—I get it. So by actually not saying Saddam was responsible for 9-11, Bush was really saying Saddam was indeed responsible for 9-11.
LOL. Reminds me of when Tom Daschle, (then) Senate Minority Leader (now private citizen), was trying to explain why the Dems in the Senate gave the President authorization to:
...use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to:
(1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and
(2) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council Resolutions regarding Iraq.
Daschle said that the Democrats, at least, were only authorizating President Bush to:
(a) strictly enforce through the United Nations Security Council all relevant Security Council resolutions applicable to Iraq and encourages him in those efforts; and
(b) obtain prompt and decisive action by the Security Council to ensure that Iraq abandons its strategy of delay, evasion and noncompliance and promptly and strictly complies with all relevant Security Council resolutions.
Q. But, that’s not what the Joint Resolution says. You also authorized him to use military force at his discretion.
A. Yes, but we didn’t think he really would do it.
Q. But, he said repeatedly that he would do it if he judged it necessary.
A. Well, yes, but we didn’t believe him.
And this is the Minority Leader of the Senate, not just some…well, has anyone actually determined what a Dreyfuze is?
And, Dreyfuze, although it appears you have slinked, or slithered, back to wherever, you can take your 2/10 for effort though.. and stick it.Posted by Kyda Sylvester on 2006 04 18 at 03:36 PM • permalinkSince Dreyfuze did not provide the quote (instead he tried to deflect it with “38 trillion google links), I’m forced to conclude he’s either a liar or an idiot.
Possibly both.
We never get any good trolls anymore.
Posted by Quentin George on 2006 04 18 at 04:58 PM • permalink#139: Talk about “gutless quislings in Congress” . . .
Paco-it’s a good thing that they didn’t tell us not to use Israeli bandages.
Is this for real??? Bush is going to cause the destruction of America
Posted by Real Social Dynamics on 2006 04 18 at 05:55 PM • permalink#151: does this mean they’re going against the advice of the generals? Have they asked Rumsfeld if it’s okay to disregard the advice of generals? Does the advice of generals count if it isn’t what the Left wants to hear? My head is spinning.
Posted by JorgXMcKie on 2006 04 18 at 06:27 PM • permalink#153 RSD
Is this for real???....er, does your question refer to the foregoing 152 comments or your subsequent assetion?
If the former, the answer is most likely to be found in the affermative.
If the latter, the answer is in the negative (although see articles by Phil Adams for solice).
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 18 at 06:41 PM • permalinkOK, troll party over. Dreyfuze, Weevil Punnet, and Real Social Dynamics (who was more of a spammer than a real commenter, if his bizarre website is any indication) have been sent to the cornfield.
Some of you seemed to be having fun, but Dreyuze and Weevil were obviously just rattling the cage. It’s possible they actually believed the garbage they were spewing here, but that’s no excuse.
Posted by Andrea Harris, Administrator on 2006 04 18 at 06:44 PM • permalinkDamn
Still waiting for one of our distinguished visitors to explain how to solve this Iran thingie. Hard to believe, but I’m starting to think that they don’t know.
Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 04 18 at 07:08 PM • permalinkMargos Maid
Easy, as long as you can bend foreward and touch tour toes you will be fine.
It will only sting a bit. (said the mullah to the quiorboy)Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 07:47 PM • permalinkSo, the secret is out. Israeli munitions manufacture process includes pig fat.
Rabbinical approval has also been given for lard bombs
Posted by MentalFloss on 2006 04 18 at 07:58 PM • permalinkEl Cid I think I used to work with that lady. 5 foot tall and 4 foot across the arse, If she’d worn bike shorts…......
Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 08:23 PM • permalinkOne good thing that has come out of all the Dreyfuze posts is that it got me to revisit the time around Dec 2002 and the UN drama pre invasion. I found it fascinating. A good place to begin is here at the UN resolutions site. It really takes you back. The last line of the resolution the UN “Decides to remain seized of the matter.” Its worth the price of the ticket on its own!
I concur with The Real Jeffs, Dreyfuze probably is not a real person, a fun program but not real. In fact, I wonder if there is a set of these programs? It would be fun to get the ones on global warming, racism in Australia and genocide of aboriginals. I could listen to them as I fly and laugh and laugh.
O/T poor baby Jack Roche (cockroach) is appealing at the equal opportunities tribunal over not getting enough Halal meat in prison.
Link http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2006/s1618516.htm
There are a number of double entrendes that spring to mind but Im too polite to suggest where he could obtain some extra meat.
Can somebody tell me why its called the equal opportunities tribunal rather than the arseclowns and fucktards commision?
Posted by thefrollickingmole on 2006 04 18 at 09:16 PM • permalinkthefrollickingmole
rather than the arseclowns and fucktards commision?
Don’t know about OZ, but here in the States, we know that group by it’s common name, the ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union…quite left of center, they are)
As to Mr Roche, he should have had a mishap on his way to prison, that left him drooling in a chair, or dead.
Thanks Andrea, I did have fun. Weevil Punnet was rattling the cage, it’s true, but Dreyfuze was a more enjoyable piece of sport. It’s always interesting to tease out the pathology of these people.
Posted by James Waterton on 2006 04 18 at 10:04 PM • permalinkratman —
jazz
the comic book
these personal computer thingies
porn that doesn’t involve pasty people wearing strangely placed leather
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 04 19 at 12:04 AM • permalinkOkay, apart from saving the world, the internet, cable TV, Elvis, jazz, the comic book, personal computers, decent porn, airplanes, sticky tape, SLR cameras (I’ll take your word for it), TP, Lifesavers, motorbikes, Velcro, telephones, communications satellites, nuclear power, the polio vaccine and the Xbox 360, what has America ever done for us?
I’m afraid Velcro was actually created by a Swiss inventor.
Posted by Andrea Harris, Administrator on 2006 04 19 at 06:42 AM • permalinkI imagine there is - in a dusty cupboard somewhere - an invasion plan of Australia. It’s a military planner’s job to consider all possibilities.
War Plan Scarlet was our between the wars op-plan for fighting Australia. It was a sub-set of War Plan Red, the plan for fighting the UK. Thankfully, it was War Plans Orange & Black that ended up being used instead.
Posted by Cybrludite on 2006 04 19 at 07:49 AM • permalink#182 TB
And you are very welcome to keep him.
Although that’s a bit harsh. Its only since Crocodile Dundee (about 20-30 years after his initial success here) that he turned into a bit of a ponce. Divorced the er, weight challenged wife of 30 years or so & took up with the Hollywood piece.
‘Hoges’ TV re-runs from the ‘70s & ‘80s are still pretty good value.
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 19 at 07:56 AM • permalink#184 Cybrludite
I’d be fascinated to know what/who was involved in War Plan Puce and/or War Plan Violet With Just a Hint of Mandarin and a Nice Turquoise Scolloped Effect.
Thankfully, it was War Plans Orange & Black that ended up being used instead.
You mean America fought the Japs & the Germans because of some-one’s colour-blindness? Whew!
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 19 at 08:04 AM • permalinkI’d be fascinated to know what/who was involved in War Plan Puce and/or War Plan Violet With Just a Hint of Mandarin and a Nice Turquoise Scolloped Effect.
According to Google, puce is a brownish-purple. (Methinks that should be a hard-c sound in that case…) WP Brown was the Phillipines, and Purple was Russia and Latin America. No idea why those two were combined. So, combined (There’s a historical basis for this with WP Red-Orange, which dealt with a UK-Japan axis.) WP Puce would be against Russia and the Phillipines.
War Plan Violet with a hint of Mandarin and a nice scalloped Turquiose effect would logically be Latin America (Purple) with support from Japan (Orange) and a Mexican expeditionary force (Green). I think I just bent my brain…
Posted by Cybrludite on 2006 04 19 at 08:36 AM • permalinkYeah alright all that stuff. But what has America really done?
Leaving aside about 75% of the English language. Most of literature in this language. And the idea that there is such a thing as a self-evident truth and that should underpin government. Film is an artform and the arts can thrive on their own merits. The Brits should be tossed out after they’ve served their purpose. And the concept that religion is one thing and the state is something else. Power needs to be divided and balanced. People shouldn’t be taxed unless they have a fair say in how the money is spent. Hereditary authority is tyranny. All human beings are made equal and all are entitled to a fair go. Imperialism is a load of horseshit. The law applies to everybody including the lawmakers. The invasion of Australia is worth risking the lives of American boys to avert. There is such a thing as human destiny. The courts should be impartial and accessible to all. Truth is not relative. The idea that humans have rights and this stuff is not just theoretical but can and should be put into practice. Science should be persued for its own sake. Space exploration is worth risking a lot. Hamburgers. Europe is a great place to visit but only a bloody idiot would want to live there. Hotdogs are an acceptable foodstuff. Tobacco should be cultivated. You can put steak and seafood on the same plate. What you do with your life is ultimately your business. Whiskey distilled in the backyard should at least be potable. GPS ...
But what else? Hmmmm?
Cruella 156
OK, troll party over. ...
Some of you seemed to be having fun, but<snivel>
<fingerpoint>
he started it!
</snivel>
</fingerpoint>Margo’s Maid 158
Damn
Still waiting for one of our distinguished visitors to explain how to solve this Iran thingie.Yeah! Plus we got dicked out of a catalog of all the swell analyses that Mr Hersch has gotten right!
Waterton 171
Weevil Punnet was rattling the cage, it’s true, but Dreyfuze was a more enjoyable piece of sport. It’s always interesting to tease out the pathology of these people.
It’s not like I didn’t need the exercise, or an outlet for these evil energies. I hate asscakes like Douche-fuze and his twinky little cheerleader, thing is ... I LOVE TO hate them. It’s like taking away a pitbull’s chew-toy.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 04 19 at 10:54 AM • permalinkGeoff @189, I just spent 5 minutes going through your list before realising you must have written it tongue in cheek. Not just the silly bits at the end but all of it. Yes?
Posted by Stop Continental Drift! on 2006 04 19 at 06:33 PM • permalink#179
In 1912, chocolate manufacturer Clarence Crane (Cleveland, Ohio) invented Life Savers as a “summer candy” that could withstand heat better than chocolate. Since the mints looked like miniature life preservers, he called them Life Savers. After registering the trademark, Crane sold the rights to the peppermint candy to Edward Noble for $2,900. Noble created tin-foil wrappers to keep the mints fresh, instead of cardboard rolls. Pep-O-Mint was the first Life Saver flavor. Since then, many different flavors of Life Savers have been produced. The five-flavor roll first appeared in 1935.
Yeah I was dissapointed a few years ago when I found this out. I thought they were from OZ.
#194
Five flavours life savers - the worst lollies ever. In the heat they melt and if they get wet they melt (you know, like in your wet pocket after swimming).
My favourites were musk and spearmint.
Grandad loved crystal mints (an ex smoker), they were way too hot for me.Dad preferred steam-rollers. And black jellybeans. (another smoker)
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Who needs a little point like ‘the truth’ to get in the way of an argument? Consider this fact. The allies lost approximately the same amount of troops IN ONE DAY on 6 June 1944 as in the last 3 years in Iraq.
These clowns would have opposed D-Day.