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The Arab street reacts to Hassan Nasrallah’s war bungling:
With the Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah expressing regret Sunday on Lebanese TV for the month-long war in Lebanon in which more than a thousand people died, many people in the Kingdom accused the Hezbollah militia of “adventurism” and being “irresponsible.”
According to Homoud Al-Bader, a Shoura Council member, Hezbollah’s kidnapping of the Israeli soldiers has taken Lebanon back to “square one.”
Jeddah resident Abu Sami said Saudi Arabia was correct when they described the Hezbollah war against Israel as an adventure. “If we look at the situation now, the only thing that Nasrullah gained was scaring Israeli citizens and forcing them to live in bunkers for a month. But let’s be realistic, what did the Lebanese people win? Nothing.”
Hasan Minawi is a Lebanese national in his early 30s living in Jeddah. He said, “Nasrallah’s regret was expected – he wasn’t even ready for this war. He did not build any shelters or at least set up an siren system to warn people about pending attacks. He was ready with arms but not with backup. He should have apologized long ago.”
Wow. Imagine how much more upset they’d be if Hezbollah had, you know, lost.
NazirAllah’s incompetence and evil is proven by the fact that he pursued his rocket firing for a whole month. All that time he could have called off his folly and saved his people much damage.
I think he wanted his people to suffer because he saw how the Western media were playing up the Israelis as ‘disproportionate’ from Day One, so he could see a propaganda victory as inevitable, and that was enough..
Too bad about the old people and children relatives his ‘brave soldiers’ left behind in the ruins to fire rockets at civilians.“What I don’t understand, is that if he [Nasrallha] knew that Israel was going to react like this, then why did he do it? In my opinion he is no different to (Osama) Bin Laden who brought destruction to the Arab and Islamic world because of his adventurism.”
It seems that our foes can learn lessons, if we react strongly enough to their threats and actions.
Who said it?
Strong horse...weak horse.
Some there there there be.
Jeddah resident Abu Sami said Saudi Arabia was correct when they described the Hezbollah war against Israel as an adventure.
The best definition of “adventure” that I’ve ever read: “An adventure is when someone else, far away and long ago, gets into very deep shit.”
Yup, Hezballah had an adventure all right.
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 08 29 at 02:06 AM • permalinkHe was ready with arms but not with backup. He should have apologized
so… if he had gotten ‘backup’ before starting the war, everything would be fine?
Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 29 at 02:42 AM • permalink#2 and #3 Talking about ME rulers and leaders and their not minding when their people suffer, I was listening to my sister read some points out of a book she had gotten about the first 10 years after the creation of the state of Israel, written by one of the UN or US guys who helped establish it… And they were talking about some countries that were negotiating with Israel, I think it might have been Egypt, Syria, Jordan and maybe Lebanon??? Anyway during the discussions the Palestinians decided to send a delegation to the talks about their future, and the only group who would meet with them were the Israelis…
Anyway, after the Israeli’s had been asked to make all sorts of concessions to help the talks progress, in the end all these countries were quite happy to not resolve it, because it left a whole bunch of dispossessed paleo’s livig in refugee camps that they could point to to convince their people and the world of how rotten and heartless the Jews were…
If they could have worked out a reasonable settlement for the paleo refugees early, which Isreal tried to do, there wouldn’t have been any festering sore to keep accusing Israel over…
While these rulers and despots and fanatics in the ME live high on the hog, they are more than happy to let their people suffer and die so they can used them for point scoring…
#12 That really is the ultimate in PC, limp-wristed, liberal-driven warfare, where you warn the enemy of impending air-raids because you don’t want anyone to get hurt. And yet the Israelis were still the ones who got the bad press.
I’m guessing they won’t be so polite in round two, when the ceasefire breaks.Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 29 at 03:47 AM • permalinkWhile these rulers and despots and fanatics in the ME live high on the hog
Not really an expression you equate with the Middle East!
Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 08 29 at 03:48 AM • permalinkBut the Age and its correspondents keep telling me that Hizbollocks actually won the war. I don’t understand. I just have to wait for Leunig’s next cartoon, surely he would not lie. Or maybe the sage words of the inestimable Lane. Until then confusion rains.
Posted by dover_beach on 2006 08 29 at 03:53 AM • permalinkMaybe not IT.... :o)
Substitute with any appropriate expression which conveys their lifestyles of mansions, slush funds, palaces, BMW’s, etc, etc.... Theya ren’t the ones going out on suicide missions…
While many of their people and supporters grovel in the dust and are given Israel as the reason for all their problems…
Totally agreed Casanova.
Who would of thought Theocratic Kleptocracies could fail?
Posted by Infidel Tiger on 2006 08 29 at 04:03 AM • permalink#13
thats right, whilst the UN and the international court talk about Israel and their “apartheid state” Jordan is kicking out Palestinian refugees -and Jordan and Palestine are the same.
It has to be remembered that it was the Arabs who advised the Palestinians to leave as they were going to wipe out Israel.
The Arab armies entered Palestine to protect the Palestinians from the Zionist tyranny but, instead, they abandoned them, forced them to emigrate and to leave their homeland, imposed upon them a political and ideological blockade and threw them into prisons similar to the ghettos in which the Jews used to live in Eastern Europe, as if we were condemmed to change places with them; they moved out of their ghettos and we occupied similar ones. The Arab States succeeded in scattering the Palestinian people and in destroying their unity. They did not recognize them as a unified people until the States of the world did so, and this is regrettable”.
- by Abu Mazen, from the article titled: “What We Have Learned and What We Should Do”, published in Falastin el Thawra, the official journal of the PLO, of Beirut, in March 1976
O/T
Shepparton, Vic
Music lessons banned for Muslim kids - this is a primary school (elementary).‘Cos music can lead to dancing and that can lead to sex.
Fucktards.
Worse, the school principal agrees and supports the segregation of Mozzies and other kids. “Respecting cultural beliefs of....” blah, blah, blah.
Today Tonite.
The whole history of the establishment and trials of Israel are so hard to establish because so many people have lied about it (to this day) and the propaganda has been laid on so thick, it would be nice to get the funding to go over and try as best as possible to make a doco setting out the real facts…
I know its one of those tales that you would never please everyone, and its so complex you would struggle to tell it logically and factually in any short period of time, but most people in both the West and East wouldn’t have a clue about whats really happened and how far the truth has been bent to suit various agendas… And so most of them are forming opinions and forcing solutions on Israel that have no bearing to many of the real historical facts…
If a useless ignorant sh!t like AL can get paid to write some load of childish drivel, and Fisk can be lauded for his wretched ramblings, you’d think some reputable journo/doco maker could find the time and the money to go and set the record straight eh.... And I probably have seen one or two good ones that focus on maybe the last 20 years or so… But not from establishment to now....
Now what network would be brave enough to then show it, and how long that journo/doco maker lived would be another issue....
From the Arab News article:
Al-Bader added, “Sadly our problems come from within the Islamic world through the hands of terrorists who claim to speak in the name of Islam, we the majority of Muslims have become the victims and our cause hurt by their acts.”
You see, they are upset only because Nasrulla’s actions hurt the cause. This is just an argument about methods, the “cause” remains the same. They grouse while the West is paying the extortionists’ price for their oil and every producer in the Middle East is raking in the money.
Do not be fooled about the way Israel fought the war re. dropping warning pamphlets, etc. Israel doesn’t do that to assuage the world’s opinion. It is for the opinion of their own people, just as it is ours. We’ve decided somewhere along the road to war that there is no enemy but that in a uniform. The rules of engagement have been moving steadily towards that idea for some time now. Such rules sound just fine and dandy when one Western nation is fighting another and everybody understands the code of chivalry that has been laid down. (Every Western nation has broken its own rules, but that’s another story.) We aren’t fighting that war, however.
In the war we are fighting, the only civilian one may be certain isn’t fighting is one in diapers. Even so, when one looks at the pictures from, say Gaza, where the men love to dress their sons in “militants” garb while they are still in the cradle, and the mothers brag that their children blew themselves up, how does one apply Western rules?
All we have done is tie our own hands and provide the enemy with the language they need to keep us in our place, while the religious war that is being fought within Islam itself progresses apace.
#24 You know, salty, that is exactly what my Israeli friends told me. The leaflets and limited response (despite what the rest of the world might have deemed it), was undertaken entirely to satisfy Israeli public sentiment.
Posted by MentalFloss on 2006 08 29 at 04:57 AM • permalink#22, yeah saw that, the guy at the end plays the old racist chestnut, “you want to us to have cosmetic surgery and have blue eyes and blond hair when we come here” [ or words to that effect ], my response, is, “no, I don’t want you here at all. period.”
They are always whining about the Americans or the Israelis being ‘in their countries’ [ re: hizbollah rally in Sydney ] and how they should leave, well, the other side of that coin is that I don’t want you in my country either. Go home, pack your bags and piss off.
This whole episode goes to show that Israel could seriously fuck up Hezbollah if the UN and the world let them. Then we would all be better off. They would cease to exist. We can’t give Hezbollah the chance.
General Patton would be squirming right now. We should all take a leaf out of his book.
Posted by The Best Infidel on 2006 08 29 at 06:39 AM • permalink#13
While these rulers and despots and fanatics in the ME live high on the hog, they are more than happy to let their people suffer and die so they can used them for point scoring…
Bingo.
Why would Arab leaders concern themselves with welfare, education, sanitation, planning, when its so much easier to simply blame the Great Satan and the Little Satan (US and Israel) in a state-controlled press.
This is why democracy is such a threat.
In a democracy, Arab rulers would be forced to look internally to solving problems, rather than taking the usual easy way out of blaming Israel. Similarly, the Arab public might start asking the hard questions like: “If this country has so much oil, why doesn’t my family have a decent home or car, yet that prince has a palace and eight helicopters?”.
Government accountability is the key to democracy. Elections etc, are only a small part.
This is why it is so important that democracy takes root in the Middle East, and similarly why those who oppose it are willing to go to such lengths to try and stop it.
This is a great article which highlights the problem I just raised, and details a solution best summarised thus: Fuck them. It justifies this answer as well.
Unfortunately, some of the comments on that post make the basic mistake of assuming that a free election equals “Democracy”. In the absence of property rights, freedom of speech, equall rights for women etc. it doesn’t. People who miss this distinction really have no business even getting involved in the argument in the first place. Sadly, people like Antony
ManbagSteinLoewenstein have demonstrated that a basic lack of knowledge is no obstacle whatsoever.#30: Unfortunately, some of the comments on that post make the basic mistake of assuming that a free election equals “Democracy”. In the absence of property rights, freedom of speech, equall rights for women etc. it doesn’t.
Excellent point, Dan. Irving Kristol noted some years ago (albeit in another context) that democracy must ultimately be concerned with the quality of life, not just with the number of votes. The Palestinians seem to be hopeless sadsacks in the art of self-governance, and doomed to a more or less permanent state of affirs in which democracy is little more than a popularity contest among gangsters. It need not be this way; however, hatred taken in with mother’s milk and underscored in the schools and in the media has a way of deflecting people from the pursuit of their genuine best interests. I believe that this will not change until the violent ones are swept away, and pending some kind of miraculous sea change in the hearts and minds of the Palestinians, it is difficult to see how the sweeping can occur without the annihilation of a relatively large number of people. And this goes for the Muslim world in general - what price survival? And the question for the West, of course, is what price “peace”? Are we content to let the hatreds among many in the Muslim world smolder, and occasionally boil over with acts of astounding inhumanity (e.g., 9/11)? How many maidens are we willing to tie to a pole, over time, in order to placate the dragon? Or shall we put our all into slaying the dragon?
#33 paco,
I’m up for it!. Scaly bastards....Posted by Daniel San on 2006 08 29 at 08:39 AM • permalinkPlacating the Palestinians (nee Bedouins)or otherwise dealing with them, (read dealing of the severe kind) will not end the problem.
The problem will not be ended until the Muslim stops indoctrinating their babies by dressing them as martyrs. Rating; Good luck.
The Muslim must end the madrassah, where the young are taught hatred of Israel, Jews in general and the West. What this entails, is simply the Muslim, ending the predominate thought of the Quran, (excuse my GWB) but to use your phrase, in a slightly different way, (Muslim interpretation) ‘You are either with us, or you are against us’. Rating; Good luck.
The Muslim must end the next rung of the ladder, by crushing the Muslim Brotherhood, the Hamas, the Hezbollah, Al Qaeda and ALL other maniacal sects Rating; Good luck.
The Muslim must end their terror tactics, which is war, made their way. Rating; Good luck.
How the Muslim world and the Western world go about this, is stated by Paco...
I believe that this will not change until the violent ones are swept away, and pending some kind of miraculous sea change in the hearts and minds of the Palestinians, it is difficult to see how the sweeping can occur without the annihilation of a relatively large number of people. And this goes for the Muslim world in general - what price survival? And the question for the West, of course, is what price “peace”?
The “Muslim world in general” will have to have it’s own final war, between the largest sects, Sunni/Shia to decide who shall carry the ‘mantle’. Which isn’t a bad way to go, (divide and conquer, has worked many times and successfully) except for OUR, “winning their hearts and mind” stuff. Let them kill each other, until the tire, or run out of their own. Rating; Better luck.
The West can do the “annihilation”, but it won’t, until or unless it wakes up and deals with those in THE West of that sympathize with the Muslim cause OF Jew hatred and hatred OF the West....and states, Enough is Enough. Rating; Good luck.Then West will wrestle with what price “peace”? . Rating; Bad luck for the West, Wonderful luck for the oppositon.
shepparton is going to be a very sorry place in 10 years’ time. to plonk such a large number of unassimilable people in one provincial town is dumb, even if the fruit industry does need pickers. i’m with costello & co - if you want to change the australian way of life, go somehere else. if you want to fit in & become an aussie, goodonyer. time to restrict multi-culturalism to food, wine & folk dancing. what? you don’t drink or dance? eat up then, and let me do your share
Also on ABC carte-Art v Globalization,7.30 tonight starred Jihad Jack Thomas’s brother tilting his cause and saying HE believed he’s a nice boy..The interview by Peter Knight also starred Lex Luther -er Lasry and the A/General had a bit part.
According to ABC -when Thomas’s case was compared to the Mr Baldy case -of being a possible danger to the public-
“Mr Baldy is a convicted criminal whereas Jack Thomas is NOT.”
We “shouldn’t fear him” just because he made some “bad decisions”
There was a political academic called Rick Smell -who truly looked as though he had come from the local rubbish dump.
Red Kezza then moved on to FOI and the complaint by the press agin the feds and treasurer in particular.It was pointed out that two ALP treasurers DAWKINS and Willis had done similar things, but of course the ABC hadn’t called them on it.
Amusingly,Kezza said chasing up FOI was a “frustrating and EXPENSIVE exercise.”
That’s ok old man its OUR money you’re flashing about.They had to fish out a “speech” from the “RETIREMENT DRINKS” of ex Public Service Comish Andrew Podger.
Don Chipp got his 5 min obit and ABC suggested we wave a big stick at Japan over illegal tuna fishing..a pessimistic assessment El Cid. However, it remains to be seen what will happen to public opinion in the west as the war really heats up. My heuristic for this says surely industrialised democracy trumps Medieval caliphate. Once the “Vietnam all over again” & “McCarthy all over again” mentality is gone, it will dawn on the population that the threat is real, unspeakably horrific, and gaining momentum. At that point, we might be in a winnable position. Stanley Kurtz thinks that will happen when Iran goes nuclear (quickly followed by Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Syria, etc).
Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 29 at 10:25 AM • permalink#35 Aye and a hearty ration of the ship’s mead for all, at the captain’s pleasure! But hold fast and watch ye well. Arab opinion seems to shift 180° and Nasrallah quickly jibes his rudderless creakin’ ghost ship, ready to sail off on a new desert breeze.
He’s the captain of one of Iran’s sleek new independent Syria class privateer vessels and hailed as a credit to the tactical wisdom of the budding World Caliphate.
#41 I dunno, daddydave. I’m cautiously optimistic long-term, but I think El Cid touches upon some very important - and worrisome - points. Civilizations - even extremely successful ones - do sometimes become overwhelmed with ennui, boredom, the decay of central, normative principles and values, and succumb to more vibrant, though less sophisticated societies. I think that what works in our favor is that Islam is no longer vibrant and creative, but powered by an “accelerant” of hatred and desperate inferiority that is likely to burn itself out, but probably not before it commits some new and horrible enormity, of the kind that would compel people in the West to react with crushing finality (whether we have the resolve is difficult to say; it is hard to envision a world in which “Medieval caliphate” would actually trump “industrial democracy”, but the capacity of mankind for cowardice, folly and indifference is great).
But I shall keep a good thought, for despair is one of the most powerful weapons in the arsenal of the father of lies.
# 41 - If Iran goes nuclear, and I assume this means they want a nuclear bomb - why can’t the good ole US of A give them one, express delivery?? Problem solved?
Posted by surfmaster on 2006 08 29 at 11:21 AM • permalinkHey, Iowahawk has photo evidence of the latest Israeli ambulance bombing !
Unless this bozo is ready to seek asylum, GWB, what in the HELL is the deal here?
Ex-Iran President Khatami Gets U.S. Visa
Despite intense disagreement over suspected nuclear weapons and terrorism, the Bush administration decided Tuesday to allow former Iranian President Mohammad Khatami to visit the United States.
A visa was granted Tuesday to Khatami and several Iranians who will accompany him, said State Department spokesman Tom Casey.
There will be no restrictions on his travel.
Khatami plans to attend a U.N. conference and speak at the Washington National Cathedral.
Isn’t that breaking your book of rules, Khatami, speaking AT a Cathedral?
No meetings with U.S. officials are anticipated, Casey said.
Well why the hell not, George? I mean he’s here, good gloablist policy, John (spit) Kerry would have George. Have a fucking State dinner...Jesus H. Christ.
41 daddy dave
I certainly can understand why you believe I’m pessimistic. Trust me, I don’t want to be, BUT...the West is being made to look like rank amateurs, by people waiting for Imam’s to spring forth from a well who are 8th Century madmen.
TEHRAN, Iran — Iran’s hard-line president on Tuesday challenged the authority of the U.N. Security Council, two days before the council’s deadline demanding Tehran stop uranium enrichment.
President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said no one can prevent Iran from pursuing a peaceful nuclear program.
Ahmadinejad also proposed having a televised debate with U.S. President George W. Bush on world issues.
“The U.S. and Britain are the source of many tensions. At the Security Council, where they have to protect security, they enjoy the veto right. If anybody confronts them, there is no place to take complaints to,” Ahmadinejad said during a press conference.
Saudi political analyst, Turki Al-Hamad, said, “These actions make us feel poignant. The only outcome of such aimless actions is feeding hatred against Islam.”
Ah yes, the backlash. Always the backlash.
If we, indeed, are looking at a nuclear ME, then we need to step up to the next generation. And whatever it turns out to be, it’s going to have to be pretty horrible. Maybe we should dust off the old neutron bomb and give it some tweaking. At least then we wouldn’t have to worry about rebuilding the damn place when we’re done.
The Bush/Rice ploy looks better to me all the time. BTW, I’ve heard that all the $$$ the Hezbos have been passing around is, indeed, counterfeit. Wait till the locals get on to that.
Posted by Kyda Sylvester on 2006 08 29 at 06:18 PM • permalinkBTW, I’ve heard that all the $$$ the Hezbos have been passing around is, indeed, counterfeit. Wait till the locals get on to that.
Why will they care? It’ll pass well enough, and it’s theft from the US, not from them.
Posted by Rob Crawford on 2006 08 29 at 08:30 PM • permalinkWhat are the chances that our apologist media and ostrich intellectual elites will draw the appropriate lesson from Nasrallah’s “Dayyum! Who’da thought they’d fight back?”
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 08 29 at 08:37 PM • permalink#51 El Cid, I’m pretty pessimistic too. I get by with the consoling thought that things will pretty soon get so bad that there will be no credible anti-war movement. I’d never thought I’d hear myself say that but there you have it. If you’re being attacked, there’s no point in pretending otherwise. I also console myself that we’re better equipped to win, once we have the will. But, like you I think that things will get a whole lot worse before this is all over.
Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 29 at 11:29 PM • permalink#51 El Cid, I’m pessimistic too. I just look for the silver lining because it’s the only sane thing to do.
Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 30 at 12:04 AM • permalinkBloody hell, how did I do that? I had too many windows open, methinks. Echo.... echo… echo…
Posted by daddy dave on 2006 08 30 at 12:11 AM • permalink
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Square one is where they will remain until Hezbollah is disarmed.
Well at least its better than the Palestinians.. they have gone back to square -10 since Hamas won the elections and Israel withdrew from Gaza.