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FEAR CITED
“I’m reluctant even to raise this as an issue, for fear someone will set fire to the building.”
-- Sydney ABC radio morning host Virginia Trioli on those cartoons
Hey, at least she’s honest.
Thats what pisses me off more than anything else. The cartoons were out there for ages before someone decided that it would be a good opportunity to pretend to be offended and whip up another angry mob, burn some stuff, lop a few heads off etc… Sane, moderate Muslims must just be banging their heads against a wall in frustration at the way these loonies behave.
#3, No need for her to look for another job or profession. They pay people at Sydney ABC on a pay scale going from cowardnice (lowest scale) to stupidity and cowardnice, to stupidity, cowardnice and lefty loonyism (SCL), thence to the highest pay scale (SCL) with “anti-Americanism”, “anti- Western culture”.
It was a long time ago but I think a similar thing happened with Rushdie’s SATANIC VERSES. I’m sure it had been released in UK and Aus three or four months before the fatwah was issued.
I stand to be corrected, but didn’t Khomeini’s fatwah on Rushdie coincide with the US release of the book? Convenient timing if it did.Posted by SwinishCapitalist on 2006 02 08 at 08:30 PM • permalinkYes, the protests about the Cartoons were arranged in England in December, 2005 and were arranged for Feb 2006 in Trafalgar Square, England. (view article to the right on page or read below)
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1939710,00.html
Muslim scholars holding emergency talks called for a change in the law to stop insulting pictures of the Prophet Muhammad being published. Officials from the Muslim Action Committee (MAC) meeting in Birmingham also called for the Press Complaints Commission code to be tightened to restrict British newspapers from following European media in printing the caricatures. A protest march from Trafalgar Square to Hyde Park on February 18 involving around 50,000 Muslims would be staged, Shaikh Faiz Saddiqi, spokesman for the MAC, said.
Dec. 2005I guess protesting about changing the Law to draw is rather drab for most Westerners.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1939710,00.html
Oh, hang on their website it now the 11th February 2006 (change of dates) and now, it’s about Protesting Islamaphobia as they describe the situation.
News: Rally against incitement & Islamophobia Saturday 11th February 2006
Date: 11th February 2006
Time: 1pm – 5pm
Venue: Trafalgar Square, London.
Public figures from across the political spectrum are expected to unite this Saturday at a rally against Islamophobia in Trafalgar Square. The action is taking place in the wake of the cartoon controversy.In DECEMBER LAST year it was about CARTOONS
United Message:
“The first message we want to send to the country is that of the legitimate voice of the Muslim community as opposed to those that hijacked last week’s demonstration outside the Danish embassy. We are people of peace and are trying to do our best also in bridging the gap between Islam and the West.http://www.mabonline.info/english/modules.php?name=News&new_topic=2
This is the one posted today.
http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=201572006
Muslims urge cartoons law change
Muslim scholars holding emergency talks called for a change in the law to stop insulting pictures of the Prophet Muhammad being published.Officials from the Muslim Action Committee (MAC) meeting in Birmingham also called for the Press Complaints Commission code to be tightened to restrict British newspapers from following European media in printing the caricatures.
A protest march from Trafalgar Square to Hyde Park on February 18 involving around 50,000 Muslims would be staged, Shaikh Faiz Saddiqi, spokesman for the MAC, said.
Full story on the link.
It appears they can’t get their dates correct, nor decide what they’re protesting about.
Wise men have said that knowledge of the self is true power. It is not clear, however, what wise men would make of the self knowledge that you are a chicken-shit.
By the way, if media outlets really did refrain from publishing the cartoons because of their Responsibility to the Public, why did many of them report that the cartoons had been published on this site and in The Courier Mail?
Wouldn’t they have had a Responsibility to the Public not to tell anyone?
Posted by Margos Maid on 2006 02 08 at 08:59 PM • permalinkI’m found the links which contradict the reason for the protests that have published by the PR machine from the Islamics in England.
Firstly, as it says it intended to protest about the cartoons and had a date in Feb. Now, it’s about Islamaphobia in England and is a different date and a different topic.
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7:30 - My 33 Sons
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9:30 - The Kabul HillbilliesResponsibility to the Public, is to report and fill the paper up with good news stories. Hopefully, with truth and accuracy and not just PR faxes that are churned out on a daily basis, I believe.
Life just is.
To almost give her a pat, she admits some kind of fear, unlike British journalists, comment from Ibn Warraq, interview the Religion report. I think Stats has nailed it.
“They always pretend, it’s true of all British journalists it seems to me, ever since the Rushdie affair, they all pretend that they are applying some higher moral principle, when in fact they’ve just been cowardly, and won’t admit that they’re scared”
Ibn has a lot of interesting things to ay, as does Hilal Kashan, Prof American Uni Beirut. Interestingly he reports that he has been unable to access more than 3 cartoons, censored Lebanon. Hope Google isn’t jumping to the tune of those tyrants as well.
So congratulations again Tim for your stand.
As to the other “cartoons”you can be sure of the veracity the pig story because
“These drawings appeared on the BBC, where imam Abu Bashar was showing the false drawings to official representatives from the Arabic League http://bibelen.blogspot.com/2006/01/false-mohammed-drawings-on-bbc.html
These urls take you straight to the nasties.
http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4159/384/1600/tegninger38.0.jpg
pighttp://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4159/384/1600/tegninger39.0.jpg
doghttp://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/4159/384/1600/tegninger40.0.jpg
den pedofile profet muhammed.Stephen Crittenden is not one of my favorites but he is on the ball about this issue.
“Stephen Crittenden: These cartoons of course are trivial. I wonder whether there’s a sense in which they’re a foretaste of much darker possibilities, if the Western academic establishment begins to openly question how the Qur’an is written, and begins to use the same historical critical techniques that have been employed in terms of the Bible, the Hebrew Bible and Christian Bible, whether we really might see trouble starting.
Ibn Warraq: Well it seems to work in some ways in a rather arbitrary way, because there has been a movement amongst certain scholars, not all, and all my research work has been to highlight the work of scholars from the 19th century up to the 20th century, who have applied the techniques that they developed for Biblical criticism, they’ve applied them to the Qur’an, and they’ve had startling results. Of course the most famous case at the moment is Christoph Luxenberg in Germany, and he’s come up with some extraordinary results.”
Luxenberg is of course a pseudonym.
Kim B on the other hand has proved once again he has no ticker and why he must never be the one making the decisions for Australians.
It is disheartening when as ratio reports the powers of darkness are making a very determined play to make Islam the controller of us all, so many of the west’s self appointed moral guardians (cowards) dismiss this as an issue about some of us not being nice. Oh and vulgar and stupid if we think the cartoons have value. What they have to say really makes arguing about how many angels you can fit on the head of a pin a worthwhile exercise in the face of this onslaught.
Hi Ros...Can I just say ..
Firstly, I am the public. I can choose to investigate any subject and choose to come to my own conclusions logically about the issue. I googled these links and by coincidence find it strange the group had the protest planned then almost started the protest, or waited for one thing to happend so they could justify their actions.
I think Tim is making a stand, and I have been quite interested with his stories, I’m new at blogging.
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Win Gold Coins on Osama’s Summer of Fun only on Chanel Twelve!
Responsibility to the Public, is to report and fill the paper up with good news stories. Hopefully, with truth and accuracy and not just PR faxes that are churned out on a daily basis, I believe. I can discover my own truths.
Life just is.
Keep the stories up so I can read them please!!
Speaking of Rushdie The New Islam doesn’t seem to get much traction in the western press. Interesting charter on that site.
Henceforth, “ABC” and “CNN” logos need to be bright yellow.
Posted by perfectsense on 2006 02 08 at 09:25 PM • permalinkOT—Tim Dunlop rues the demise of good solid arguing by the rightwing.
The notion of tough, smart, funny and fair arguments from the right is something you can notice missing on comment threads all around the blogosphere ... it’s hard for anyone serious on the right to mount a fact-based case on these issues ... I reckon a lot on the right are secretly (and not so secretly) embarrassed by the betrayal of conservative politics, ethical standards and plain old democratic values by, especially the Bush administration.
OK, as some of you might know by now, Karl appointed me as the Morale Officer. So maybe I’ve should have put down my assault rifle, don a dress, become more empathic and asked this before now.
Is anyone here embarassed by the Bush administration? Does anyone feel betrayed possibly? Even secretly? Come on, speak up, you can tell us. I’m here to help you.
Posted by wronwright on 2006 02 08 at 09:45 PM • permalinkIn Washington, US President George W. Bush said the violence must stop. “I call upon the governments around the world to stop the violence. To be respectful. To protect property. To protect the lives of innocent diplomats who are serving their countries overseas,” said Bush.
He, however, said that although a free press must be respected, it also comes with responsibility. “With freedom comes the responsibility to be thoughtful about others,” Bush said in his first public comments on the issue.
Trioli waxes on about how we need to be more tolerant and accepting of other cultures.
The problem is, in her diatribes she addresses non-Muslims.
She is one of the High-Preiestesses of Multi-Cultism.
Looks like it’s not working Virginia.
Posted by Jay Santos on 2006 02 08 at 10:14 PM • permalink"Why can’t Muslims take a joke.”
“With freedom of choice and access to information come doubt. Western scholars doubt whether Mohammed ever existed [2] or, if he existed, whether the Koran was invented two centuries after his death, or indeed whether the Koran even was written in Arabic. Christianity and Judaism are bloodied - indeed, drained almost dry - by nearly two centuries of scriptural criticism; Islam’s turn barely has begun. “
This guy Spengler Asiatimes online is great fun. If they burn down embassies for cartoons about him, what would be the reaction to claims in the western press that if we can have cartoons about mythical figures like Santa then we can have cartoons about mythical figures like Muhammed.
I was listening this morning and I personally got the impression that statement was made in half-jest.
It’s one of those things I’d like to listen to again because honestly I can’t remember precisely how the discussions on her program took place.
But from my very hazy memory I do believe that the way she said it and the context in which she said was less a kow-towing to islamic violence and more a statement about those that might react to the discussion.
If that makes sense.
I’ve got to say, that if it was a submission my ears would’ve pricked and I’d probably have a better recollection. Being less offensive it has sort of faded into a blur. And make no mistake, despite however you may take the above statement there was a frank discussion on the issue.
Virginia Trioli is clearly a racist, assuming that muslims will automatically torch the building..... ;)
Hey, she didn’t even have the nerve to say “muslims”...
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 02 08 at 11:31 PM • permalinkThis is scary:
EU commissioner urges European press code on religionPosted by Angela Bell on 2006 02 08 at 11:38 PM • permalinkFor Ros,
I’m sorry it must be my communication, I thank you for understanding my position, I think it must be my communications.
Yes, as Jung says it “it’s a coincidencia oppositorium”
The reality is in the west the are minority at the moment,and are the Majority in the Middle Eastern countries. So either way who’s law do you use. Which truth to freedom for British and European democracy?
Disregard France, I guess it’s socialist so it’s views will be different. However, the Ideology of Islam is the same everywhere, and that’s where they say it’s above the western laws.
Interesting read in you posted Angel, and once again:
the EU faced the “very real problem” of trying to reconcile “two fundamental freedoms, the freedom of expression and the freedom of religion.
By agreeing to a charter “the press will give the Muslim world the message: we are aware of the consequences of exercising the right of free expression, we can and we are ready to self-regulate that right”, he said.
This sounds like once again, the Europeans are being trained like Islamics to talk the talk so to speak and confuse truths.
I’m not sure, they may be offended by the action from the cartoon, however, they are free to hold threats against the “public” saying die etc?
What’s the pay off? More oil, wheat, funding, bribes?
This is great story
Cartoon contest fights hate with humor
A Jewish student group is sponsoring a cartoon contest to counter an anti-Semitic comics competition in Iran.
The World Union of Jewish Students this week announced its international editorial cartoon contest, Fight Hate with Humor, an effort to “stand the Iranians on their heads.” The Hamshahri daily launched a worldwide contest for cartoons that question the Holocaust in response to the publication by European newspapers of cartoons satirizing Islam’s prophet, Mohammed.“The whole thing about the Iranian contest would be hilarious if it weren’t so terrifying,” said editorial cartoonist Edward Margolis, who is backing the WUJS contest along with cartoonist Noah Crissey.
Submissions can be made until May 1 at http://www.wujs.org.il/home/cartoon.php
The Belmont Club has revealed that the cartoons were published in an Egyptian Newspaper during Ramadan (Oct 05) without any public condemnation. Seems likely that this recent rioting is indeed a genuine Islamic beat-up aimed to intimidate the Danes when they take over the Security Council chair. Denmark will be under heavy undue Islamic pressure as it tries to rein in Iran.
A sneaky yet tactically sound move I grudgingly admit. seeThe Past as PrologueProjected curiosity…
How might I, as an Australian without internet access, see the cartoons which are at the centre of this hullubaloo? It is my general understanding that a primary task of the media is to place world events in context. The ABC is too politically correct to offend anyone but non-loony-left WASPs, The Bulletin too cowardly, Fairfax too disorganised etc etc etc. All can find good excuses for completely failing to inform their customers ie, to do the basic job for which those organisations were created.O/T Kinda. Aussie ‘muslim village’ forum members discuss blogger Tim Blair
Posted by Lucky Nutsacks on 2006 02 09 at 12:26 AM • permalink#22: Wronwright:
My morale was sky-high until you started talking about putting on a dress.
Seriously, no embarassment here in the Paco household in re: President Bush. And the commenter’s notion that the blogoright has been short on fact-based arguments on this or any other issue is pure, wishful thinking. On the contrary, it seems to be the lefties who approach facts as if they were rattlesnakes with irritable bowel syndrome.
(If you do wear a dress, I say go with the yellow taffeta).
wronwright, I’ll put on a kilt, but not a dress.
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 02 09 at 01:02 AM • permalink#43—read that thread, Deo. Most of the commentors are being obtuse, it seems to me. Not deliberately so, but certainly clueless to a degree. Some of them can’t tell if the Islamic rioter in that photo, standing in front of a burning embassy during anti-cartoon protests, is displaying peace or victory signs.
Oi.
Posted by The_Real_JeffS on 2006 02 09 at 01:10 AM • permalinkEU commissioner urges European press code on religion
Speaking of slippery slopes how long until dress code.
On the other hand it is a bit late to start worrying about slippery slopes, we have been sliding for quite a while now.
And all on behalf of a man who may not have existed and if he did seems unlikely to be responsible for passing on the words of this rule rigid ideology.
The Eu has Franco Frattini, we have the weaseling Bomber.
“But I also happen to think that editors need to exercise a degree of responsibility, particularly if they’re in mainstream papers and I can think of myself, as a Christian for example, if I saw in the ‘Sydney Morning Herald’ a cartoon which depicted Christ on a cross, fully demanding of his followers that they kill Muslims I’d be more than a bit annoyed and I’d have a thing or two to say to the editor.’
Like it is common knowledge that Christ converted by the sword and passed on an offer from above of luscious dames as a reward for cleaning up the infidels.
Do the words “slippery slope” come to mind when you consider how so many are bowing to the ROPers over this (non)issue?
#35, great point. It’s picked up in Miranda Devine’s column today:
Acceptance of their intolerance - it’s all part of radical Islam’s plan
The reaction to the religious riots epitomises an increasingly enfeebled West, writes Miranda Devine.THE insane violence of riots over religious cartoons is a flexing of muscles by those men of the Islamic world who have long felt emasculated and insulted by the West’s economic superiority. Empowered by Osama bin Laden’s September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, they have also been emboldened by the West’s internal divisions and its feeble response to increasing acts of intolerance and provocation.
Posted by Art Vandelay on 2006 02 09 at 02:31 AM • permalinkTim
Check this out:
http://freedomforegyptians.blogspot.com/2006/02/egyptian-newspaper-pictures-that.html
May I suggest a new addition to your extensive Blogroll.
Perhaps the Arab League will now condemn Egypt?
That Frattini strikes me as a complete and utter coward.... sort of like Beazley but becoz he seems to be in power as a commissioner he’s more dangerous as his words actually carry some weight…
U would have thought Europe and the western world would have learn from the experience of the dark ages only ending when the catholic church stopped deciding what could and couldn’t be published, and know not to head back down that road of letting religion either censor what knowledge can be printed, or forcing editors to “self censor” what can be said!
We escaped from the dark ages, the mussie world is still in it, and i’m not keen to take a trip back down memory lane thanks very much!!!!!
Don’t pat the Trolloli dog,she’ll bite your arm off toute de suite..
No wonder all ABC’s are so security conscious and have been ordered to lock all doors.
The Media report/whitewash on radio national today never even glanced in the direction of said drawings.Like sbs they prefer to block their eyes and ears and screech “I’m a teapot” until it goes away.
It’s a wonder they can still hold up their heads but at least it means no terrorist is holding up their heads (for a little longer than the general populace.)
If and when the “revolution” comes La Doogue will don the burqa faster’n you can say Julie McCrossin (relieving Life Matters host) is a lesbian dad…
Yet remember the money and care lovingly lavished on the massively expensive “Brides of Christ” anti catholic expose docudrama by ABC and how happy all those proud EX catholic former private schoolgirls and boys at Public Broadcasting embrace any other religion.Or no religion.
Trioli also taken to task in today’s Media section Oz for inviting Malcolm Turnbull into her parlour ostensibly to discuss Water.Ambushing him several times failed to flush out the info she really wanted -info on Eddie McGuire (from schooldays).After a tranquil but savvy Turnbull “with exquisite politeness” demurred and said he would discuss Water he was peremptorally dismissed by the Shallow one.wronwright — I’m only embarrassed that Malaysia hasn’t pulled Tim Dunlop’s posting permit. Wasn’t somebody supposed to look into that...?
He’s well on track to catch to Margo-dom…
Posted by richard mcenroe on 2006 02 09 at 10:49 AM • permalinkNO Rebecca! I don’t want to borrow your shoes. I’m not saying I will be wearing a dress. I’m using a metaphor.
This is exactly how silly rumours get started about me. About the orbital space lasers. And the time machine. And um other things.
Posted by wronwright on 2006 02 09 at 03:35 PM • permalinkWW 22
Frankly, yes. Relative to Reagan, this boy is a clown. BUT he’s so far enjoyed the great good fortune of being opposed by clowns even clownier than himself. Given the choices that actually exist, now in 2006, I end up having to back Bush. But I did vote against him, twice. Happy now?Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 02 09 at 05:04 PM • permalinkRos 48
Like it is common knowledge that Christ converted by the sword and passed on an offer from above of luscious dames as a reward for cleaning up the infidels.
Christ personally? No.
Charlemagne converting the Saxons? Yes. The sword thing, not the virgings thing. Christian conversion-by-sword is historically real, and denial serves no good cause.
But, that said, that was a LONG-ass time ago, and the Muslims are STILL doing it.Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 02 09 at 05:46 PM • permalinkBut there are differences, Stoop Davy. For one thing, forcible conversion of non-Christians by Christians is not a basic teaching of Christianity. All men, Christian or non-Christian, are considered to be sinners. “All fall short in the sight of God.” Therefore there is a basis for protesting acts of war on non-Christians that simply doesn’t exist in Islam. Remember: in Islam there are two kinds of people: Muslims and non-Muslims. All non-Muslims live in the “House of War”—in other words, they are considered, by their very existence, to be at war with all Muslims. Many Muslims deny this, some out deceit, and some out of denial, but that doesn’t make it any less true.
Also, the pagans that Charlemagne converted weren’t the equivalent of Christians in Muslim lands who were forced to convert: the Saxon tribes’ religion included such things as live human sacrifice. One of the many reasons (besides wanting to bring as much of Europe under the rule of the Holy Roman Empire as possible) for Charlemagne’s wars against the pagan tribes was their habit of attacking monasteries and sacrificing priests to their gods.
Posted by Andrea Harris, Administrator on 2006 02 09 at 07:07 PM • permalinkDon’t rush out to buy anything expensive just yet, Wronwright. Ask Lee Tamahori if he’s got anything in your size.
Posted by SwinishCapitalist on 2006 02 09 at 08:01 PM • permalinkFor crying out loud, I wrote a comment referring to Tim Dunlop’s outlandish post about conservatives not making good arguments anymore. And I received more comments back about me wearing a dress and ladies’ shoes.
Folks, please focus here. Geesh.
For the record, I do not wear women’s clothing. But if I did, I probably would look good in yellow taffeta. I have the legs for it.
(SDD, you voted against George Bush? And you’re still alive? Maybe that goat attack on Mugabe was a suicide mission.)
Posted by wronwright on 2006 02 09 at 11:31 PM • permalinkDread Kali incarnate 67
But there are differences, Stoop Davy. For one thing, forcible conversion of non-Christians by Christians is not a basic teaching of Christianity.
That certainly is an important difference, but it might not be the most important one. The main difference I’m thinking of is that most of the examples of bad Christian behavior, at least on a large scale, are at least a quarter of a millenium old. Bad Islamic behavior, on the other hand, is making today’s headlines.
Also, the pagans that Charlemagne converted weren’t the equivalent of Christians in Muslim lands who were forced to convert:
Charlemagne made a good move there, is the way I see it. He solved a serious public safety problem in a bloodshed-minimizing way. I’m not here to dis ol’ Carolus Magnus.
the Saxon tribes’ religion included such things as live human sacrifice. One of the many reasons (besides wanting to bring as much of Europe under the rule of the Holy Roman Empire as possible) for Charlemagne’s wars against the pagan tribes was their habit of attacking monasteries and sacrificing priests to their gods.
Ew! Public incineration of live human victims in an outdoor religious ceremony is a nasty business. Thank goodness all of that came to a screeching halt as soon as Christianity became widespread.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 02 10 at 10:03 AM • permalinkMr Minion of the Month AGAIN 69
Maybe that goat attack on Mugabe was a suicide mission.
Dunno about that, but it MIGHT explain why it’s taking them so long to un-goatify these baaaahack legs of mine.
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 02 10 at 10:06 AM • permalinkPW 72
Carolus Magnus
... [blah blah blah] ... Karl RoveThere’s a difference?
Posted by Stoop Davy Dave on 2006 02 11 at 07:07 PM • permalink
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How soon we have forgotten this truly outrageous cartoon.
As for the delayed rage, LGF reports that the cartoons were published in an Egyptian paper
way back in October!